Brett Schoffner: Plan Governance & Fiduciary ROI | Retireholics

[0:00] JD: Follow through. [0:03] Speaker B: I put something on LinkedIn about finishing that exam. I took a nice deep breath of fresh air. I can stop highlighting papers, and then [0:10] Speaker C: I need to know how to calculate permitted disparity by hand. [0:13] Chad: You know, this is one of the. [0:14] JD: This is one of the many advantages of the fiduciary accredited retirement technician because [0:21] Chad: you can pop in and get your [0:22] JD: fart in, like, 30 seconds and be done with it, you know, and to go through all this hassle. [0:30] Speaker B: Look at you, Shannon. Everybody take it. Wow, that's commitment there. Hence why you sit on ARA board and. [0:41] JD: Right. She's part of that, for sure. I've got a little ASPA news today. [0:50] Speaker C: Yeah, it was good news. [0:51] JD: Bee's knees. [0:52] Chad: Do you have your. [0:53] JD: Explain to me the bee's knees again. [0:55] Speaker E: So. So the bee's knees is a. It's a classic drink, so I don't. I don't think there's anything terribly revolutionary about it. Might have been like a prohibition kind of thing. But I have to say, shout out to my wife. She has become a pandemic craft cocktail. Just perfected it, which is just fresh lemon juice, honey, syrup, and Hendrix J, I think. [1:19] JD: Oh, I saw her post in detail. Like, exactly how she. [1:23] Speaker E: Literally. Our whole neighborhood. [1:25] JD: Yeah, Right. [1:26] Speaker E: Coming over, like, making up excuses, like, showing up. And then they're like, hey, you guys want to do bees knees, you know? [1:33] JD: Right. That's so cool. [1:35] Chad: That's so cool. Brett. [1:36] JD: Most of my neighbors run inside when they see me on my street, so I don't really know much of my neighbors. Chad. Don't shake your head, Mark, because I. [1:46] Mark: That's a. That's a. That's an absolute lie. [1:48] JD: That's not you, you know? [1:49] Speaker B: No, no, no, no, no, no. [1:50] Mark: You run inside. [1:52] Chad: Oh, sure. [1:53] Mark: Social one. [1:54] Speaker E: Totally. [1:55] Mark: They want to talk to you. [1:56] JD: Like, hey, buddy, how's your landscaping? The good news is my wife is, too. Mark. We were walking the dogs the other day, and up on this cul de sac in our neighborhood, all the families had gotten together with, like, lawn chairs out, and all their young kids were around, and there must have been 20 of them sitting in a circle. And my wife and I looked at each other, and we're like, holy shit, what a nightmare. [2:19] Chad: I'm glad I'm not in my head. [2:23] JD: Antisocial, antisocial. [2:25] Speaker C: JD Richard wants to know if you dyed your hair. [2:28] JD: Dyed my hair? [2:29] Speaker E: Sure. [2:30] Mark: Dyed your beard. [2:31] Chad: Oh, you know what it is? [2:32] Speaker E: It's a little bit of. [2:33] JD: A little bit of a camera filter here, so I don't look as red on the camera. Normally, I'm bright tomato red. [2:42] Speaker C: I was telling the boys this morning we were talking that I had a dream about you last night. Sounds really weird, but you had cut all your hair, like it looked like Brett's, but you still had your beard. [2:54] JD: I think I had a nightmare. [2:56] Speaker B: To his old days. When I first started working at pdc, JD had this. This surfer physique that looked like he was a world class athlete. He had a picture in his office of him, like, carrying Tristan with the wetsuit halfway down. He looked like a mediocre bodybuilder at the time. I'm like, Damn, J.D. every day. Every day. [3:17] JD: Staying in shape. [3:18] Speaker B: Now we just surf and drink beer on Thursdays, right? [3:22] JD: You should see me now, bro. I've been getting fit, man. I'm on, like, day 50 and crushing the treadmill we got going on here. [3:29] Speaker E: Nothing beats surfing, though. You guys know that half of the Navy seals were surfers? [3:35] JD: You know. [3:36] Chad: You know how when you do something [3:37] JD: your whole life, though, like, so I've been surfing since I was seven. I. My body's used to it. I don't think it's any physical exercise for me. Surfing, it's just too used to it. I got to do other shit. [3:49] Speaker E: Yeah, but that's because you've been doing it so long. Take a break. Like, after I moved to Florida, I took a long break, and it was just unbelievably difficult. A couple times I got back out there. It's embarrassing. Yes. [4:06] JD: Shannon. S words. All that work now that I've been doing has been on the peloton. The peloton bike and the treadmill. I love that shit. [4:16] Speaker E: We lose Mark. [4:20] JD: Two minutes to showtime. And mark seven fails. [4:26] Speaker E: Handler has brought. There you go. [4:28] JD: Nice. [4:36] Speaker E: There you go. You got requests for the rest period. [4:40] JD: Wait till the show's. Wait till the show's over. And then she's gonna be like, if you ever do that show again, I'm divorcing you. He's gonna be a. It's gonna be a drunk mess by the time we get through with Acro Sin. Well, there's always a guest room. Do you see the pour, though? [4:55] Speaker E: That's a great. See, again, a savant. [4:59] JD: Oh, look at that. Look at that. Could you pan down to the perfectly poured? [5:05] Speaker E: Doesn't go that low, but all right. [5:09] JD: Ice chips on the side. Very nice. [5:12] Speaker E: Whoa. [5:14] Chad: Oh, it looks. [5:14] JD: Yeah. [5:15] Speaker C: That's gotta be the most impressive drink we had on the show. [5:18] Speaker E: Pretty good, man. They go down real easy. I'll penalize myself. Yeah. [5:27] JD: Kristen Is that Kristen? Is that the wife's name? [5:29] Speaker E: Kristen? Yes, yes, Kristen. Another Californian. She. You want to talk about surfers? She was a good one. You ready? Maybe not as good as Rincon Point Doom. That's where she. [5:40] JD: Oh, sure, yeah. North of Malibu. [5:41] Speaker E: That's a legit. [5:43] Chad: Yeah, Isn't that. [5:44] JD: That one I served when I was younger. It's, like, gated, right? Get up in there. [5:48] Speaker E: Yeah, yeah. [5:50] JD: That's a nice little point break. Malibu is a sick point Break, man. I love that wave. Do we really lose, Mark? Do we really lose, Mark? [5:59] Speaker G: You mean gyro? [6:00] JD: We did okay, Whatever. [6:05] Speaker G: I haven't checked to see if he's. Oh, there he is. [6:07] Speaker C: There he is. [6:08] Mark: Jesus Christ, man. [6:10] Speaker E: Just. [6:12] Chad: You're the talent, bro. [6:13] JD: You scare me. [6:14] Mark: Check on him, dude. [6:16] Speaker B: Well, you may have died, Mark. [6:17] Speaker G: We all worry about you. [6:19] Mark: Worry about yourself. [6:21] Speaker G: You have problems, Mark. [6:23] Mark: And also Chad. It's hero. [6:29] Speaker B: Yeah, but you spell it like Gyro. Oh, come on, Mark. [6:36] JD: I think we're close to getting. Hey, how you doing? Welcome to another episode of Retireholics. I know it's a guilty little pleasure. You. You run to the refrigerator to grab your favorite booze and your significant other looks at you and goes, what the fuck are you doing? Are you going to go watch that silly show again? You, like, say yes, and you scamper down to the basement or the back room and you crack that cold beer or whatever you like and start watching your show. Well, I am here to tell you, don't feel guilty about it. [7:36] Chad: You are a stud. [7:37] JD: You are a 401k learning sponge, and you're great at your craft, and you should be proud of yourself for tuning into the show. And I'm proud of you for joining us. Before I get started with some of the little housekeeping, it's a special day today. I don't know if y' all know this, but it's Justin's birthday. Happy birthday, Justin. [8:01] Speaker C: Wow. [8:01] Mark: Thank you. [8:05] Chad: I hope you're hungry. Happy birthday, Justin. [8:11] Speaker B: Oh, man. Thanks. [8:12] JD: Have you had a great birthday day? [8:14] Mark: Yep. [8:15] Speaker C: From this desk, it's been amazing. [8:17] Speaker E: Very good. [8:17] JD: You know, you can always call in and say, hey, boss, I'm not showing up today. It's my freaking birthday. I'm out of here. [8:23] Speaker C: I did that last week. [8:24] Speaker B: Yep. [8:25] Speaker C: 24, Webby. [8:28] JD: 24. 25, gallery view. Make sure you're in gallery view. That's the best way to do this thing. Are we going to have a CBC chat bar champion? Yes, we are. So, Brett, do your best to pay attention to the chat bar. [8:43] Chad: No, I haven't said that yet. [8:44] JD: I haven't. No, no. [8:50] Speaker C: Started new. [8:52] Chad: Purposely put chat bar champion in front [8:54] JD: of Acro sand to save myself. So screw you. I'm smarter than that. [8:58] Chad: So Brett, pay attention because you will vote for someone. And you out there in the audience, [9:03] JD: you pay attention that chat bar too, because you will vote to send people to the or you will vote on the finalists and pick the winner. So that'll be a lot of fun [9:11] Chad: if you are a past chat bar champion. [9:14] JD: Guess what? I sent out all the chat bar champion swag yesterday. And assuming you got back to me with your address and your shirt size. So check out your LinkedIn messages if you didn't. But I think I got about 90% of you, so even those people that won, like way back in December, shit is coming your way. And I was shocked at how many times Hackler had won before. He's definitely the goat of the cbc. Acro Sin. [9:44] Chad: Brett. [9:46] Mark: There's so many. [9:47] JD: We're going to play Acro Sin. [9:48] Chad: It's not. [9:50] Speaker E: This is not good. You're picking on me already. [9:52] JD: If you say any acronym example, pep, tpa, whatever. [9:59] Chad: Starting now, you have to drink from your nasty drink. I'm actually doing. Show everyone what your nasty drink is. [10:09] JD: If you got one. I'm actually doing a little chardonnay tonight. [10:14] Chad: Chad, I haven't picked you. [10:17] JD: Let's see. And that's that. [10:20] Chad: So that's that. Justin, introduce our guest. [10:23] JD: Everyone. [10:24] Chad: Who we got? [10:24] JD: Who's here? What's the dealio? [10:27] Speaker C: Mr. Brett Schoffner? Am I pronouncing that right? [10:31] Speaker E: You're good. [10:32] Speaker C: Not only is he. Well, shit, you're gonna learn tonight, they got some really, really cool shit that they're doing. Probably the only thing I've ever been on board for. For sharing all the employee data, as you people know. But outside of that, he is quite the family man. Outdoor enthusiast, he loves wakeboarding, golf, does a ton of snow sports. Also does peloton. Jd. You guys might want to compete. [10:54] Speaker E: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [10:56] Speaker C: So. And 15 weeks ago, he narrowly escaped death. I'll let him tell you that story. But it was pretty freaking cool. I think I. I kind of stalked your. Your social media there, bud. [11:11] Speaker E: Anyways, say I was gonna say, how'd you know about that? Yeah, that's kind of random. Although when. When things like that happen, it's the wake up call. [11:20] Speaker C: Yeah, definitely. But glad you're here. So, outside of that, can't wait for you guys to learn about the. What's the acronym here. What are we going with for the company? [11:33] JD: Oh, I don't know, man. [11:34] Chad: You have to. Yeah, that's not the company Plan Governance index there. [11:39] Speaker C: The index. [11:40] Speaker E: Sorry. [11:40] JD: Okay, everyone. [11:42] Chad: Everyone in the audience, give me a [11:43] JD: 1 to 10 on Justin's intro of Brett. What do you think? [11:46] Speaker C: That was terrible. [11:49] Chad: You know what, though, Justin? [11:51] JD: Terrible is good sometimes. [11:53] Chad: Gyro. [11:53] JD: Oh, gyro 2.5. [11:58] Mark: You forgot to mention that he's also [12:00] Speaker E: a big [12:02] Speaker C: A Raider. [12:03] Speaker E: Yep. [12:04] JD: Oh, nice. [12:05] Speaker B: Oh, I didn't see that. Purposely avoid that kind of stuff, Mark. [12:08] Speaker E: It's a sad admission. [12:10] Chad: I don't think. I don't think. Now that Justin brought it up, I [12:13] JD: don't think we can go straight past. Can I vote here? No, I can't. [12:17] Mark: Why can't we vote? [12:18] Speaker C: Where's the negatives now? [12:21] Chad: Let me. Webby, People are out there. You can't see the results, can you just. [12:25] JD: I can. Of this poll. [12:27] Speaker B: You have to post it. [12:29] JD: I didn't know that till now. Okay, so let's see. It's all over the board. It's over the board. I'll share it. Whoa. What's going on? Stop sharing. I don't know what to do with the polls. [12:40] Speaker E: Yeah, there you go. [12:41] Mark: It's because it's your birthday. Everyone's being. [12:43] Speaker C: That's what it is. [12:44] Chad: That fucking sucks. I'm gonna. I'm gonna write Justin next week and [12:48] JD: be like, hey, bro, can you do the intro? And he's gonna be like, fuck you. I. I'm not doing it. [12:53] Speaker E: I'm part of the goal. [12:54] Speaker B: Kick it back to you, Judy. [12:57] Speaker C: You're too kind, Buddy, you give me shit every week. [12:59] Chad: I don't think we can just move [13:01] JD: past the serious story that Justin brought up. [13:03] Chad: So I think we're gonna have. I can't just blow past it, Brad. Go ahead. Start us off with a near death experience. [13:10] Speaker E: I know. Look, I'll make it quick. I mean, first of all, Florida known for bad drivers, right? So it's just your classic. Like, we moved out of our New York City apartment that we had for 17 years. Don't have to go into that. But we had a storage unit, West Palm, where we had all the stuff. So my wife says, hey, can you grab our neighbor's SUV and meet me over there? Sure. So I go down. Great neighbor. She works for workday. Oh, boy. [13:38] JD: Sports utility vehicle, buddy. [13:40] Speaker E: That didn't take long. I was testing you guys. Anyway, I borrow my neighbor's suv. [13:50] Chad: Real sis. Brad, if you could maybe. [13:57] JD: Go ahead. [13:57] Chad: Go ahead. [13:57] JD: Keep going. [13:58] Speaker E: Oh, Sorry, man. So I'm on the floor to turnpike where people drive 80, 85. I get a flat tire, so I pull off, blah, blah, blah. I'm like finding the, you know, the jack and the whole thing to change tire. And luckily there's like a little key that's usually like a star or some other stupid symbol. And basically it was the wrong one, so I couldn't fix the tire. So I go into the passenger seat. It was really windy. To make a call to like, AAA kid you not. Out of nowhere, some woman at seven miles an hour, bam. Just. Just nailed the car. And like, miraculously I walked away. She went to the hospital. Both cars were totaled. And here we are, and my neighbor doesn't talk to me anymore. [14:44] Chad: I was just gonna say, like, screw your near death experience. You had to walk to your neighbor and be like, hey, you know your car, yeah, it's fucked. [14:53] Speaker B: It's gone. [14:54] Speaker E: Yeah. But you know what? She's actually. She's a sweetheart. She's great. She got a better car out of it, so there are no hard feelings. She ended up getting a better large vehicle, and it's all good. And you know what? Here we are. So those kinds of things, though, it makes you realize, like, life is important. Don't mess around. Make every minute count. I know it's cliche, but does remind you of those things for sure. [15:19] JD: Chad feels that way all the time when he has skiing Florida. All right. [15:26] Speaker B: Little perspective helps. [15:28] JD: Yes. I'm glad that it hit the car and not you and. Or the car didn't hit you. [15:33] Chad: Let's do a little headlines. [15:34] JD: You know, just recent things that have happened in the industry. We'll do it a little bit quick. Found my notes here. Oh, little podcast, Spotlight. [15:45] Chad: If you haven't checked it out, I've [15:46] JD: mentioned it briefly before. [15:48] Chad: Check out Revamping Retirement. [15:50] JD: I'm doing a little. Little promo for our buddy Webby. I was listening to his most recent one this morning, and I'm not kidding. I'm not just trying to be nice the guy, because he's one of our family here. [16:02] Chad: Guy's slick, man. He's smooth. Silky smooth and professional. [16:06] JD: And I was just really, really impressed with his podcast. So check out Revamping Retirement, and let's dive right into some headlines. [16:16] Chad: The. [16:16] JD: I saw this headline about a bunch of TPAs getting together. I've never seen. I've never seen something like this before. Maybe Brandon can throw up a little article if he has it doesn't have to. But on aspa.org, the title of the [16:32] Chad: article is New TP Check, [16:38] Speaker B: Man. Mark is on it. [16:39] Mark: The one before that, sir? [16:41] Chad: Yeah, I got the one before I [16:42] JD: got the one for that. [16:44] Chad: I won't name all the firms, but there's about nine of them. [16:47] Speaker E: TP [16:50] Chad: third party administrators that got together and created this, this group. [16:55] JD: Now, I don't know a ton of [16:56] Chad: details of it, but it's called this, isn't it, buddy? This is not the 45 second one. We're going to get to that one. [17:07] JD: What do you think about it? [17:07] Chad: I'll go straight to Mark. [17:08] JD: It's called the Serato Group. I don't know if I'm pronouncing that [17:11] Mark: right, but I enjoyed reading the background of the name. I thought it was pretty cool. Yeah, the idea that they decided not to use any of the typical bullshit words that all the other third party administrators use. But in reading it, I. I mean, again, I'm a. I'm a t. I'm a third party administrator nerd. I'm all about it. [17:35] Speaker B: I'm cool. I'm happy. [17:36] Mark: We're a community. They came together, so I'm in. I like it. I'm trying to understand what's so different about it and what's. Cause they're all remaining independent. But I guess leverage, I guess I look at it like an aggregator. So I'm like, oh, are we going the trend? Is our industry looking at it from that perspective now too? [17:57] JD: Analogy. It's a good analogy, Chad. Why do you think they're doing it? [18:00] Speaker B: I mean, when I read the press release and the article, I didn't get the impression that anything was really changing other than they're leveraging each other's knowledge, skillset, history, maybe access to some tech. But it's not a. Someone said, and I'll use the term, a pooled employer plan set up for third party administrators. I don't really think, other than this being like an association of relationships, does it change much? It's not a future plan. They're not buying each other, not joining forces. One administrator from one firm is not helping a plan of another. But they're using this as a group to gain insight from one another is the way I interpret it. [18:41] Chad: I think it could be the same [18:42] Speaker B: thing we're doing here. Right? Well, we do. It's true. We have a dozen TPAs listening in right now. JD, you and I reach out to Shannon every once in a while with questions. And Amanda, like, yeah, it pretty much is that same. [18:57] Speaker E: Yeah. [18:57] Mark: Is Amanda here? Because look what's on [19:03] JD: Shannon S words has chimed in a little bit and she's talking about maybe they've got some purchasing power. Right. So you're talking about I think it's like nine or ten shops and I think it's like 9,000 participants, you know, billions of dollars and so they can work discounts and work angles through different softwares and technologies. And Chad, to your point. Yeah. I think also they can work on things like how will they solve cyber security and maybe they can pull together and come up with some type of solution. So I don't know. I think there's lots of advantages. [19:36] Speaker B: I was sad when we didn't get the invite. I figured we were too risky for them. But no, I think it's a good thing for the industry. But does it change the service model? Does it change their offering? Does it change. I don't think it changes anything other than an open dialogue and perhaps, perhaps the third party administrator community having a greater voice than what we do as individuals. [20:00] JD: I'm open minded to it. There's some smart people that in that group that have joined and so yeah, the Shannon's got all kinds of great stuff. Yes. The TPA benchmark and there are little associations of. I said that. Of third party administrators. This is a little different. This is unique. [20:18] Chad: And we'll set the jury stay out [20:20] JD: there and we'll see what happens. But I think there's opportunities there and [20:24] Speaker B: the gallop the helm by the way and I'm going to butcher her last name to ski. She's a, she's a rock star. I mean she's going to be so good at the helm there. [20:36] JD: Hancock. [20:37] Chad: Did you see that? Did you see that? [20:38] JD: I think she lives on the Big island in Hawaii now. That was kind of cool. [20:43] Chad: Anyways, next, next big headlines. I thought this was really cool. I'm interested in Income America. [20:53] JD: See if I can pull this up here on my little tablet. I saw Wolnowitz, our old friend of the show post this and I gotta find it. Here we go. I lost it. [21:05] Chad: Go to go to Chad. [21:06] JD: Maybe you can go to incomeamerica for me.com or and tell me who are all the firms that have partnered on this thing. [21:14] Speaker B: Oh, I just had it up actually but now it popped down. I remember seeing Lincoln in there. American Century Lincoln Wilshire. Go ahead. [21:26] Speaker C: Wilshire Nationwide Prime Capital and one I'm not going to say because it's an acronym. [21:32] JD: Security software and consulting. Yeah. [21:35] Chad: Yeah. So wow. I'm like okay, someone's coming to the [21:40] JD: market with a Guaranteed income type thing, which we've all talked about that in our industry, some have come and failed. And so this one's unique in that there's all these companies collaborating together. [21:51] Chad: What's going on here? [21:52] JD: This is different. [21:53] Chad: This is new. Brett's our guest. Did you catch wind of this, Brett? [21:57] Speaker E: I did, yeah. I thought it was interesting. And, you know, a quick shout out to Franklin Templeton because they put together this survey of the American worker. I don't think it's public yet, but it supports exactly why products like that are coming out, which is people want that. They do, right? I mean, they do. Do they want it if it's packaged as an annuity? [22:20] JD: No. [22:21] Speaker E: But when you package it as guaranteed income or some version thereof, they want it. [22:26] Chad: I think the weird story here is, [22:28] JD: Chad, how do you feel about most of the time it's individual companies that try to create these things. This is different. Where a bunch of companies come together. [22:38] Speaker B: Well, yeah. [22:39] Speaker G: And I think the hesitation that many groups have had. And JD I'll pose a question back to you after I answer this, which is what's actually different than GIFL or what was created by Great west back in the day? I think it was Secure foundation and some of those other products. [22:53] Speaker B: But one of the big hiccups was [22:55] Speaker G: it was never transferable. Right. To another provider. They're saying that, yes, you can do that here, but it's six or seven other providers, like, the likelihood that you leave one and end up at one of those others is probably minimal. And I know that some other record keepers have tried to bridge that gap by saying, well, we can keep it as an outside asset and you need a TPA to do the trust accounting and leave that money behind. No longer make contributions to it, but that makes it portable. If it's left behind, I don't know. I don't see anything different in this than what's already been positioned in the marketplace. [23:31] Chad: Well, we're going to have, I think [23:33] JD: Wolnowitz is going to release to the world that he's playing a role here in some way. And I think that's going to come out in the next few days. And then we're going to have Matt back on the show on the 18th so two weeks from now and we can ask him more about it. So just bringing it up to everyone out there to take a look at and see that. [23:52] Speaker B: Okay, let me make one more comment. [23:54] Speaker G: Brett, you're right, the industry does want it. [23:56] Speaker B: There is a need for it, there [23:58] Speaker G: is a fit for it. But Even when this was brought up by Hancock and Prudential back in the day and Great west, it was always a sales technique that never took off. We did and do a lot of Hancock business. The opt in rate on gifl was 0 to 01. So I know we're calling for it, but nobody has been using it in the past. [24:19] JD: You can say giffle. That's, that's doesn't. That's guaranteed income for life. Yeah, I guess if you can't, I'd have to drink. [24:28] Speaker E: I didn't vet it. I mean literally, I saw it yesterday, I just kind of briefly read over it. But I know those companies, I mean companies like American Century and Lincoln are usually pretty forward thinking. So I'm hoping that once we get all the details, maybe it is a step in a better direction. But we'll see. [24:45] Speaker B: I hope so. It's needed. [24:47] JD: We'll see, we'll see. But Matt's a smart guy. If he's involved, I'm thinking there's something that we're not seeing there. So we'll talk to him in a couple weeks. [24:56] Chad: I told Mark. [24:57] JD: I also added a third headline I want to talk about Nevin Adams came out today. The ARA was some big news. And I said to Mark, this counts. [25:06] Mark: This counts. You gotta take it right now, Ken. [25:08] Chad: Oh, I do. Are you counting down? The news is that yeah, there was a tremendous victory for the ARA and cola. That's it. [25:20] Speaker B: Oh, come on, you can't leave it at that. [25:22] Speaker E: That is bullshit. [25:23] Speaker G: And your cost of living adjustment is an acrosant as well. [25:27] Mark: Yeah, I got both of them. [25:28] Speaker C: Oh, it is? [25:28] JD: Yeah. For that. [25:30] Chad: Okay, you win. [25:31] JD: Mark, did you drink your second one? [25:32] Chad: I said let's talk about it. [25:34] Mark: And you've literally told our audience you [25:37] Speaker C: haven't told them any, anything. [25:38] JD: I know. [25:39] Chad: And Mark says, why are you gonna, why are you gonna add. [25:42] JD: It's gonna take too long. I said, Buddy, it'll take 45 seconds or less. And he goes, I'll bet you whatever that's not gonna happen. You're too long winded. It's gonna take forever. [25:51] Chad: So I was gonna do it quick, [25:52] JD: but clearly I can't. [25:54] Mark: This is a big deal. [25:55] Chad: I'm going to read from the ARA article here. They had this big act, okay, shit. This big act that was going to go through. Well, did go through. It was going to freeze cost of [26:11] JD: living adjustments for the total money you could put into a defined contribution plan into a defined benefit plan. [26:17] Chad: And it was going to do that in 20, 30. [26:20] JD: Hats off to the American Retirement Association. Because if you told me you're going to do something 20, 30, I would have been like, oh, shit, that's a long way off. Who cares? [26:27] Chad: But they're smarter than that. And quote from Brian Graf, this was [26:33] JD: a tremendous victory for the American Retirement association and the retirement plan system. [26:40] Chad: Nevin was super excited about it today. [26:42] JD: Nev. [26:43] Speaker E: They. [26:43] JD: They've. [26:43] Chad: They fought hard right now. Right on, Nevin. [26:47] Speaker B: Well done. [26:48] JD: So anyways, that's little headlines. There's that winking Nevin that I love so much. [26:53] Mark: Nev. Actually, just trust that I could easily log in as a attendee and just call myself Nevin. So we need to have some, like, a good idea verification checks. [27:05] Speaker B: Oh, we can ruin little. [27:06] Speaker C: The blue check mark. [27:07] Mark: Yeah, there you go. [27:09] Speaker B: I'm gonna log in as Greg Greenfield, [27:13] JD: get me really excited, and log in as Fred Reich. And then burst my bubble. I was like, oh, Fred's here. [27:18] Mark: Oh, my God. [27:20] Chad: We've talked a little bit. Let's go ahead and spin the wheel. [27:23] JD: And Brandon, there's a new. [27:24] Chad: There's a new angle to the wheel. We decided to double up. So if the Smirnoff wheel lands on you and then this second little thing, [27:33] JD: which I haven't seen yet, lands on [27:35] Chad: you, you have to do what's called [27:38] JD: not a boilermaker, but a frozen maker, which is a shot at something in your smearing off. I don't know. Brand's got a cool image for it, but. [27:46] Chad: So it's gotten more dangerous. [27:48] JD: The wheel of ice, basically. Go ahead and spin it. Let's spin it. [27:58] Mark: Nice, Nevin. [28:02] Chad: Brandon, I think. All right, so now that's Brandon. [28:08] JD: Something else has to happen to see if he gets the double penalty. This is the first time, so we're. [28:16] Speaker E: No, didn't hit me. [28:17] Chad: It didn't hit it. [28:17] JD: Okay, whatever. [28:19] Speaker B: I'm sure it didn't hit you. [28:21] Speaker G: Sure. [28:22] JD: Play what it looks like for the crowd if they. If you can. What's. What's a frozen maker? [28:28] Mark: Yeah, but we didn't see a spin. [28:29] JD: Are you supposed to have maker's mark smearing off ice? [28:32] Speaker B: He made it up. [28:34] JD: You drop it in like a boiler. [28:36] Chad: It is terrible. [28:37] Speaker B: B. [28:39] Chad: But it didn't. [28:39] Speaker B: Katie and Brandon wrote that via email to us. I just wrote back and said, I quit. [28:43] Speaker C: Brett, see if your wife can work on a variation to that. That actually tastes good. [28:47] Speaker E: Even my couldn't save that Irish car bomb. [28:50] JD: Brandon's drinking this Smirnoff. [28:53] Chad: I was going to go to poll [28:54] JD: question, so we'll wait a second. [28:58] Chad: Can you throw up the poll question audience, you're going to choose what we're [29:02] JD: going to talk about next. So Brand's gonna throw it up on screen, you vote for it and then we'll talk about that while I have a little casual sip of my beer. [29:10] Chad: Nevin, you did a great job today [29:12] JD: on the Leaf House webinar. That was fun to listen to. Here's your choices people. Are proprietary investments. Okay, outsourcing in 316. What's that all about? Should advisors focus on Cash Balance? [29:27] Chad: Don't go Income Solutions guarantees. We literally just talked about this shit. [29:32] Mark: I'm not voting. [29:33] JD: It's bad to overrule that. [29:35] Speaker B: Did you just smell your beer [29:38] JD: and oh Chad, your dreams are going to come true. I think up. It's a tie. It's a tie. Proprietary investments. Okay, Cash Balance. Chad, let's start Cash Balance. Should advisors sell Cash Balance? Tell them, Chad, tell them. [29:55] Speaker B: I don't think you should sell it, but I think you should consult on it. I think every advisor should understand the staircase of funding and know that if you have a client that's making good money, consistent and has an employee base that's a little bit younger than the ownership or the executives, finding a way to create heavily funded tax favored plans for those owners is crucial and they love it. And you will build cpa, dang it. Certified public account relationships immediately. If you understand how to spot Cash balance plans and you're willing to talk about them. [30:29] JD: Brett, you're not just a Hero7 guy. You'll do other things in your life. Has Cash Balance been a big part of your career at all? [30:38] Speaker E: Answers no, but that's only because I'm a reforming triple effort. Right. Where providing institutional consulting to bigger retirement plans I think is a disappearing business. And you got to broaden your horizons. You got to think more holistically. And that's exactly what Chad's talking about, which is it's an underserved market for sure. Cash Balance makes sense in the right situation. And I think that prior a lot of guys like me that weren't going after, you know, smaller companies or more niche plays like that, we were dealing more maybe like in the mid market, you know, plain vanilla 401ks, 403bs, whatever. We overlook that. And I think now, especially if you're adding wealth management to your practice, which you absolutely should be, or you probably won't be in business in 10 years, then that makes it even more important. [31:32] JD: Well, that's interesting. [31:33] Chad: So Chad, back that up in terms [31:36] JD: of validating what's a good prospect or a candidate for cash balance. Brett's right, Right, right. They can't be too big of plans. Doesn't make a lot of sense. So what are you looking for? [31:46] Speaker B: They can be, but it's not the ideal fit. Right. There's a number of businesses. We set one up last year that was 120 employees. You only have to cover 50. But the goal there was to create a benefit for the 37 executives that they had in this law firm. So that fit really well for them. But the typical fit is going to be a closely held practice. 1, 2, 3, 4 partners, whatever it may be, with a staff that is half the age or at least 10 years younger of your partners and a group that has stable income. So call it the ideal client in my mind, outside of owner only shops or real estate agents, which it fits well for, would be 10 staff members, three partners. Stable income partners are making, you know, four or 500K and they want to shelter to 200K or so. You've seen the staircase of funding. I typically say if your goal is north of 100 grand as an individual, then we need to evaluate whether or not a cash balance fits for you. [32:49] JD: Right. And. Or if you, if maxing out in your defined contribution plan is not enough and you want to go more. Yeah, Check, swing there. Then you should be thinking cash balance. Right. [33:00] Speaker B: Well, for those that haven't seen it, that's the staircase. Right. You want, you want 10k of sheltering. As an owner, your first step is 401k. You want 20 to 30k, then you use a 401k with a safe harbor plan. You want 50 to 60k, use a 401k safe harbor profit sharing plan. You want to go above that 60k mark. Hence what JD is saying, you're not getting enough. And Then defined contribution, 401k, safe harbor, profit sharing, cash balance. That's the staircase. You walk up each of those steps, Chad. [33:29] JD: It's actually referred to as the magical staircase. But that's okay. [33:33] Speaker B: Where you strap on a cash balance. [33:35] Chad: Let's go [33:38] Speaker B: see if you will. [33:39] JD: Inside joke. Inside joke. [33:42] Mark: Brett. [33:43] Chad: Proprietary investments. Is there a place for that these days or is that just a total. No, no. [33:52] Speaker E: Before I say that, you better keep an eye on Chad. He's pretty good at pitching the cash balance plans. Might be looking for a job on proprietary investments. You know for sure it's an issue. I think it's weird because we're coming back to it. I don't know why. Maybe you guys can Help me out. The clients don't seem to want. Caused a lot of problems. When you read erisa, it doesn't make a lot of sense, but somehow it just keeps creeping back in. And I mean, I guess it comes down to margins and trying to make. [34:23] JD: Trying to make some money, Right? Trying to generate some revenue. [34:26] Speaker E: Right? Yeah. But I guess I would just say this, that the best thing from an advisory standpoint, which I've been an Advisor for almost 20 years, the rule that saved me, I had some good mentors early on. Just do what's right for the client, stick to that. And generally that's kind of the opposite of proprietary. It's, you know, keep flexibility open, have access to a lot of different investments, don't get pigeonholed, don't make deals with the devil. Because a lot of times when you take the lower pricing to take proprietary sounds great on the way in, but a couple years later, there might be a whole new committee. And you're sitting there and you're like, oh, I got to take out these proprietary stuff because it's failing the fund monitoring. And all of a sudden it's like, oh, the pricing is going to jump 30%. [35:12] JD: Right. [35:13] Speaker E: Well, who set this up? Oh, yeah, that was me. I mean, it's not a good spot to be in. [35:18] Chad: You just nailed the con to what [35:20] JD: I was going to say as the pro, I was going to go, well, what if it helps you in pricing? But that was well put. Brad is like, well, I could come back to bite you in the end. [35:28] Chad: And then Nevin. [35:29] JD: Nevin brought up some recent lawsuits. Right. So, I mean, those lawsuits haven't come to fruition yet, but it's definitely getting us big spotlight. [35:40] Speaker B: Yes, John, I'll play the other side of it. If the advisor is signing on as a338 and they're screening these investments and the proprietary meets all metrics. And you've got. What I've seen is you've got a $15 million plan and you're going to get three or four basis points off all 15 million to offer this proprietary suite, whether or not it's utilized as a stable or a cash equivalent, that is in the best interest of the [36:08] JD: participants at that time. [36:10] Speaker B: At that time. Now, if it's meeting your metrics and you're comfortable with all that, and someone posted in their T. Rowe. T. Rowe has a way out. They say, look, we want you to use our proprietary, but if they don't meet your metrics, you can show us that we will allow you to take out our proprietary target date suite. Bring whatever you want in. And we will not adjust the pricing because that means our proprietary suite hasn't met your criteria. [36:35] Speaker G: I think that's attractive. [36:36] Speaker C: I think that's huge. [36:37] JD: Without a doubt. [36:38] Speaker C: I mean, kind of going back to what we talked about last week when we learned about the new lawsuit was one of my biggest comments or concerns was for American Funds and Principal, who are doing that right now. So if that could trend across everybody. [36:52] Chad: Yeah. The lawsuit that you're thinking about and [36:55] JD: I'm thinking about is with Vince's collective investment trust. Um, Remind me the name of those suckers. Uh, shit. I'm blanking on. [37:05] Speaker C: I don't want to say. I think you're baiting us. [37:07] JD: No, no, no, no. Anyways, that. That's their proprietary fund. [37:12] Chad: I don't. [37:12] JD: Have we seen lawsuits yet on strictly. Just like, oh, you're offering your own target date funds or your own this or that when it's still flex path. Thank you, Rhonda. Thank you, Rhonda. [37:24] Speaker G: Gosh, that was hurting. [37:25] Chad: Cause that would. [37:26] JD: Cause Justin's right. That would be a scary, scary world if we started to see lawsuits go down where people are getting penalized for proprietary funds because they're all over the damn place. [37:37] Speaker B: We have. [37:38] Speaker G: There was an old Tussie versus ADB Inc. [37:41] Speaker B: Right. [37:41] Speaker G: That was. That was Fidelity with their target date funds that they pushed into the core menu. Didn't lower the cost. You don't even know if that's an acro sand, mark. [37:52] Mark: You said a bunch of letters, dude, I'm gonna. But. [37:55] Speaker B: But the problem. [37:57] Speaker G: Fidelity pushed in their proprietary and then didn't lower the operational cost of the plan. And that was like a billion dollar plan. [38:04] JD: I felt like that also had like a share class angle and then another conflict of interest angle. Like that thing got a little deeper and messier than that. But. But yeah, Justin, to Justin's point, our industry would go upside down if this became something you couldn't do. But then let's wrap it with Brett's comments. I agree. You do what's right for your client. We. We were moving as an industry towards true open architecture and real independent choice in terms of investments and institutional share classes. We'll see if we continue down that path and don't head back in the wrong direction, but we'll see how that goes. [38:38] Chad: Brandon, let's pull up the second poll [38:41] JD: and let the audience choose what we discuss next. [38:47] Speaker B: He's quiet the entire show. That's what we're going to do. [38:51] JD: Oh, he's gonna get a chance, and [38:52] Speaker B: then we're gonna turn him loose. [38:54] Chad: Passive versus active cash balance plans. [38:56] JD: How'd that get in there again? Bundle versus unbundled. [38:59] Speaker E: And I have a thought here. [39:01] JD: As Chad would say, best practices around requests for proposals. [39:07] Speaker B: Oh, I thought he was gonna dive right into that. [39:10] Speaker C: Brad. [39:11] Speaker E: What, you thought RFPs? I don't know. Legal witness drink? [39:18] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. [39:20] JD: All right. [39:20] Speaker B: Maybe he wants to see that pretty cocktail. [39:22] JD: Maybe we'll get a little bit of time on that one. Let's start. Mark, I'm an advisor. You're walking into my office. [39:31] Chad: I work bundled, bro. Why the hell should I work with [39:34] JD: some silly guy in a robe? Why would I go unbundled? What's the deal? [39:38] Mark: First off, you shouldn't work with a silly guy in a robe. If a guy in a robe walks in your office, probably call security. That would be my first move there. But if I'm walking in that office [39:49] Speaker G: with a three piece with normal, with [39:52] Mark: a Tom Condren three piece suit on, then I'm going to tell them a lot of things. JD how much time do we have? Because I do feel like we should be talking to Brett about Hero 7 here. [40:04] Speaker E: Moment. [40:04] Chad: 45. [40:05] JD: 45 seconds. [40:06] Speaker E: Okay, perfect. [40:07] Mark: Work with me. Because if you don't, [40:14] Speaker E: you know what they say? [40:16] Chad: You know what they say. Solid bundled. Solid. [40:20] JD: Bundled versus unbundled advice. You just. You got it here, you got it here. [40:24] Chad: All right. Thanks for that, Mark. [40:25] JD: Appreciate it. And I know the audience appreciates it. [40:29] Chad: Brett, Hero 7. What is it? And why the name Hero 7? [40:34] JD: Let our audience know what the heck's going on. [40:37] Speaker E: Look, Hero 7 is not about pulling, you know, babies from burning buildings and changing in a phone booth. We think that there are a lot of everyday heroes, and in order to be like the best version of yourself, you got to have a solid financial position. Basically, you got to be well financially, physically, and mentally. And so that's what Hero7 is about, is about benefits. And in the workplace, there are a lot of people that are struggling in those areas, and we think there's an opportunity for advisors to lead the charge and help people become the best version of themselves. Right? The best neighbor, the best spouse, the best co worker. Just fulfill your potential. And I think that's hard to do in a world where costs have escalated. The price of homes and cars. Everything has gotten away from a lot of Americans. So there you go. [41:32] JD: Three piece wants you to get a little closer to your mic. I don't know. He's having a hard time hearing you. Tell us about the Plan Governance Index, also known as what, Mark? The pgi. This is something new, it's something different. What is it? Let the audience know. [41:54] Speaker E: Yeah, sure. So you know, as an advisor, when you go in to consult on a retirement plan, you know, it's gotten a lot really complicated. Like 20 years ago, it wasn't complicated, frankly. Right. It was just a product. You'd come in and sell something that was fine. Then it evolved a little bit into the whole fiduciary movement, you know, monitoring some funds and that whole explosion. But now we've evolved past that where there's a lot of moving parts. Right. You've got QDIA, you've got wellness, you've got 3 16. Sorry. Jeez. [42:27] JD: Sorry. [42:27] Chad: You can finish your thought, you can [42:29] JD: save up your, your pound. Yeah. [42:30] Speaker E: 338, 321. Cyber Security. I could go on. Right. So the question becomes for an employer, who the hell's watching all this stuff? And I've seen it a million times. I know you guys have too. It's like the old. Well, I like we could have done this, but we could have sent those notices. We thought, you know, the third party administrator was sending them or whatever. So the Plan Governance Index allows an advisor to come in and make sure that everybody knows who's doing what. You know, imagine the concept of like fulfilling on your service agreement all these various prudent experts, and I'm talking auditors, asset managers, record keepers, third party administrators, advisors. The whole lot of them were all under the same standard. But the key here is it puts the advisor in charge, which I think had been missing. Advisors had been ignoring administration because they didn't understand it and they didn't think that they could help. And now there's a way for them to take credit for aligning with really good administrators like the people on this call. [43:39] Speaker B: I think many advisors have been trying to do that for years, but there's been no way to quantify it, track it to show that that's what they're doing. And some have been successful anyways. But now it sounds like. And I'd like to get more into what you guys are actually doing with the. I'm going to drink for it because I'd like some more screwball. The PGI and the tools that these advisors can use. But I think that it's needed and they've been trying to do it and now you're giving them a resource to actually accomplish it. [44:11] JD: I felt like we're such a, we're so good as an Industry at ranking different things. Right. We've got all these little systems and five stars and one through tens and we've got the web rating as one of those. [44:25] Chad: But I don't think I've ever seen [44:27] JD: beyond like kind of what you saw from Brightscope. I don't think I've ever really seen something that ranks an actual plan for how it's accomplishing their responsibilities. And that's when I first heard about the Planned Governance Index. I was like, oh, that's fricking cool. Like, it would be neat for plans to kind of see where they're at and the way that they break it. And by the way, you can go to hero7.com and you can see the little. Oh brands putting up right there. Yeah. So it's in three different areas, Right. Participant outcomes, the investment process, and what I love plan administration. Check that out, Shannon. Or see something that gives you a little TPA score, which is kind of cool. So anyways, I thought this was great. Sorry, Chad, what was. I'll drink for that. What was your question? [45:14] Speaker B: Oh, well, I have a series of [45:16] Speaker G: questions, but I'd like you to keep going, Brad, on what you guys are doing, how you're accomplishing this, how advisors can leverage it, who it fits for. And then as you get into the next topic is where some of my questions come in, which we all know. We prepped for this show, so I knew what his next topic is. [45:33] Speaker E: Yeah, I'll make this simple. So imagine this, right? I've been doing fiduciary committee meetings for literally, whatever, 18 years. Then we create this Plan Governance Index and I start going to my own clients, rolling it out. I kid you not, people were saying, thank you. Thank you for being on top of things. This is great. We feel buttoned up. What a relief. I mean, like, to a person. That was the feeling. And I gotta be honest, that never happened before. When I was coming in talking about funds and fees, it was like, whatever, good. See you, bubba. So it just changed the dynamic and it made the clients feel like they were covered, which is important. So it's that governance aspect and then there's a module there that's all about outcomes. And again, back to the Hero7, the larger vision. Outcomes matter, okay? They matter to Companies who spend 83% of their overall expense budget on their employees. Think about that. Like, that's a huge capital spend. [46:36] JD: Say that again. Say that again. They spent 83% on their what? [46:40] Chad: What? [46:41] Speaker E: On their people. Through salary and benefits, the average company. Yeah, 83%. Okay. That's a, that's a massive number. Like, you're worried about your marketing costs. You're worried about 83% is spent on your, your freaking people. You need results there. So one piece of the puzzle there to the Plan Governance index is about outcomes and making sure that if it's a DB or a dc, it's designed right, that you're pulling all the levers you can to get results. [47:14] Chad: Todd, is that a real. [47:16] JD: Is that a real question? Todd? Does the 83% include owner comp. I don't know. Probably. [47:21] Chad: Don't be a dick. Yeah, no, for sure. I mean, I'm. [47:28] JD: That way you're run and I'm a mom and pop shop and I look at what are my biggest line items. It's salaries and benefits. For sure. Right? For sure. So, yeah, you preach in the choir with me. I just like the idea. I think the industry for the longest time has used checklists, right? Like you go into these fiduciary review meetings. Go ahead, Chad. [47:50] Speaker B: Sir, I was just going to say I think what the industry has used is they've looked at participation and defense rates, right? Like they've looked and said of, of your staff, what's our participation percentage? And of those people participating, what's the deferral rate? That's been the way of quantifying the success that we've had as an advisor community, getting the plan to reach better outcomes. And what Hero7 is doing is saying we're taking the outcomes conversation beyond participation and deferral rates. And that's what I haven't seen. I know MassMutual tried to roll something out a few years ago that I thought was sexy. On the same topic, I haven't seen anybody else come anywhere near this. And that's what's attractive to me. And that's what I think is part of this future. [48:32] JD: And Nevin, go ahead. [48:34] Speaker E: I got a question for you guys. So let me ask you guys a question. Why did Bill Pellet, did Bill Belichick win so many games? And why does Nick Saban dominate? [48:45] Speaker B: Because they build a system. [48:47] Mark: Because they cheat. Cheating aside, because the Tuck rule was a fucking disaster. [48:54] Speaker B: That's. [48:55] Speaker E: I don't think Saban cheats. But here's the bottom line, all jokes aside, like, you know, Alabama doesn't have 14 players, okay? Like the Patriots don't get five downs. They have better process. And literally that's what this is about. It's a system. It's a process. It's giving advisors the ability to win with scalable Software, better process, just like Saban and Belichick. That's it. [49:20] Speaker B: Well, my, and my comment to you, Brett, One of my comments back to you is if you're an advisor and you're using something like this, you're not, you're probably not going to lose the plan. Because anybody that comes in and tries to bid for the business behind you, what are they going to show? If you're getting fired because you're not creating better outcomes, what are they going to show? That's going to, that's going to allow the client to say, oh, you're better. You're creating better outcomes for us. They've got nothing. And I think that that's a big go to, for, for, for advisors. [49:55] Mark: I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm just saying there's nothing that's bulletproof if you go in and present that the right way. Sure. But if you stuck and you go in there and try to show these to be no idea what you're saying, the hell doesn't matter. [50:10] JD: Well, that's part of using a tool like this. And that's to Brett's point. If you're going to go in as an advisor and you're going to talk about fiduciary and funds, I guess this is kind of fiduciary. But you're going to show them, like, look, instead of just looking at the funds and the costs and the participation, we're going to actually look at you as a plan sponsor and whether you're doing the things you need to do. I can tell you as a business owner myself, I'm a lot more comforted that I've got the right people on my team. Because we all know, especially in our market, guys, if you're, if you're in the micro market, you're south of 50 million. Like, your clients are not going to be getting sued by Schlichter. [50:50] Chad: The problems they're going to have are [50:52] JD: going to be with the IRS and the Department of Labor. [50:53] Mark: Knock on wood there, buddy. [50:56] Chad: The problem they're going to have are going to be with the IRS and [50:58] JD: the Department of Labor. And so I'm going to sleep better at night as a business owner if I know that my advisor is making sure that I'm taking care of the shit I need to take care of on the admin side, the compliance side. [51:08] Mark: So, JD I love how the sun's shining on you right now. [51:12] JD: Thank you. Thank you. [51:14] Mark: Like an angel. [51:15] Speaker E: Mark. [51:15] Speaker C: We need a dinger. I guess he said international revenue spur. [51:18] Mark: Who Did. [51:21] Chad: Did I say it? [51:24] Speaker B: International Revenue Service. [51:27] Chad: Was that me? Was that me? [51:28] JD: Okay, that's me. [51:30] Mark: You better get it right. You got a drink for that one? [51:34] Chad: We're going to talk. We're going to talk about the second [51:36] JD: part of what Hero7 is kind of working on. They're boiling up here. But before we do, I got a little surprise for everyone out there. We're bringing back today, the lamer game game. [51:49] Chad: Mark, take it away, buddy. Lamer games back. Webby, it's back. [51:55] Mark: Just. Just for you, Webby. [51:57] JD: Even Nevin said awesome. [51:59] Mark: Wait, where's my intro? [52:04] Speaker C: Oh, such a good game. [52:06] Mark: Oh, Brandon, I love you. You're so good. All right, Brett, are you aware of what the lamer game game is? [52:16] Speaker G: It needs no explanation. [52:19] Mark: Sounds like it. Looks like he does. [52:21] Speaker E: Question answered now, but needs no explanation. Perfect. [52:25] Mark: I'm gonna give some questions out. I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm gonna always bring it to you first and you tell me if it's gamers, if your game or if it's lame. Okay, first one. [52:36] Speaker E: Here we go. [52:37] Mark: Bringing it back. Prepped for this about 13 minutes ago. Saying the words, wearing a shirt, putting it on social. And any way you do this of I'm going to say air quotes, positive vibes only or saying, ah, it's the vibe. [52:57] Speaker B: I don't know. [52:58] Speaker E: Just gonna leave it at that. [52:59] JD: Yeah. [53:00] Mark: Brett, is that lame or are you game? [53:03] Speaker E: It's game, man. I'm partial to surfing in California. Sorry. Good vibes. Good vibes are always in. [53:12] Mark: All right, I'll go. [53:13] Chad: I'll go to the surfer next. [53:15] Mark: J.D. [53:15] Chad: is it? Is it. [53:16] JD: Can you say like that's a vibe? Is that what you're referring to too? [53:19] Mark: Like, okay, that's one of the umbrella statements. [53:22] Chad: Yeah, I'm okay. [53:23] JD: I'm game with that's a vibe. Like I say that with my daughter. My 18 year old daughter. That's. That's a vibe. That's. [53:28] Chad: Yeah, it's not. [53:28] Speaker C: Surprise. [53:28] Mark: I forgot you have kids of that age. [53:31] Speaker B: Chad, that is lame. Absolutely. I'm all down with the vibe, but I don't need to say it. Like we can create positive energy around. [53:40] Mark: Did you just say I'm down with the vibe? [53:43] Speaker B: I am. [53:46] Mark: That's why I love you, Chad. Stick to cash balance plans, Justin. [53:51] Speaker B: Depends on it. [53:52] Speaker C: Depends on the person. To me, [53:56] Chad: it's literally a yes. [53:58] Speaker C: I know, I know. It's sometimes it's lame, sometimes it's game. [54:02] Chad: I wish. [54:02] Mark: Whoa. [54:04] Chad: It's not okay, is it, Mark? [54:05] Speaker C: It's perfectly it's my birthday. It's perfectly fine. [54:11] Mark: You woke up today and you're like, my birthday. Positive vibes only. All right, this one results. Actually, this one relates directly to Justin because of this. I know his answer already. But, Brett, I'll go to you first. Taking the day off on your birthday. If it falls between Monday or Friday, if you work the weekend. Lame. Or game. [54:32] Speaker E: Game. All the way. Birthday's special. [54:35] Speaker B: Game, Chad. [54:37] Mark: Game. [54:38] Speaker C: Justin, does that mean I can sign off right now? [54:41] Speaker B: Yep. [54:41] Mark: Log out, dude. Log out later. [54:44] Chad: Happy birthday. [54:45] Speaker C: Game. [54:45] Speaker B: For sure. [54:49] Chad: I hope you're hungry. [54:50] JD: No, I'm always working, bro. It's always in my head. Birthday or not, man. [54:54] Mark: Figured as much. All right. Getting rid of the lamer. [54:58] JD: Game. [54:59] Mark: Game, Brett. [55:01] Speaker E: Lame. [55:02] Mark: Thank you, Chad. [55:07] JD: Look at the audience, bro. I love you, Mark. [55:11] Speaker E: Lame. [55:11] Mark: Mark. Astonishment. [55:14] Speaker C: I'll go with lame. [55:16] Chad: I thought Justin would say it depends. [55:18] Mark: I know, right? [55:18] Speaker B: Lame. [55:20] Mark: Depends. [55:20] Speaker B: How good is it this week? [55:22] Mark: My last one. [55:23] Speaker C: Lame. Nice, Greg. [55:27] Mark: My last one. I think it's a redo. I'll be honest. I think I've asked this before, but I'm just getting so sick and tired of it. On Instagram, when people post their stupid maps of how far they walked or rode a bike or jogged or hiked. Brett. [55:46] Speaker E: Sorry, is there a question there? [55:53] Mark: I'm giving you my opinion. Somewhat, but you still have your own options. [55:56] Chad: Yeah. [55:57] Speaker E: Yeah. That's kind of like, dude, someone hit my wife. What should I do? [56:01] Chad: Like, damn, he's saying it's lame. [56:05] Speaker E: Okay, it's lame, Chad. [56:07] Speaker B: I'm lame for sure. I don't even know. I know you are. [56:11] Mark: Dustin Lame. [56:15] JD: Every. Every time I finish a workout. [56:18] Speaker B: JD don't answer until you read what Nevin just wrote. Fred Reese does that. Fred Reese post his walking and his running pass. [56:26] JD: Every time I finish the workout on peloton, it says on the screen, do you want to share this, like, with the Internet? [56:32] Chad: I'm like, why the fuck would I want to share my. My stupid little pussy ass workout? I just said, like, I ran a mile. Send it out. [56:40] JD: No, I don't. It's lame. [56:44] Chad: Sorry, Fred. [56:45] JD: Sorry, Fred. [56:47] Mark: Oh, you know what they say. [56:49] JD: You know what they say? [56:50] Speaker E: You know what they say? [56:51] JD: I miss that. I miss that. I miss that little segment means a lot to me. Warms my heart. Brett, Hero7 is not just about the planned governance index. You guys are cooking up a little something in your kitchen that relates to data and advisors using data with their clients. Can you give us a sneak peek? Can you tell us what you're Working on. [57:15] Speaker E: Yeah, sure, we want, again, we're all about advisors and we think that back to that 83% spend, you know, the employers need help. They need visibility into a return on investment, not an acronym on that big spend. Right. And so in order to do that, advisors need the right data. Number one, they need the right data. And so that, that really constitutes two things. They need data into the benefit stack of the company itself, but then also the employees. And notice that I didn't say plan participants, it's employees, all the people that work there. And I just think that for many years we've been arguing record keepers and advisors, oh, let's get the data, give me your data, blah, blah, blah. I think that they've been largely digging in the wrong place. To quote Indiana Jones in one of those films. Advisors need to get around that and just get the data that matters to them, which is holistic, which again pertains to the benefit stack of that company. What does the company need to offer? Benefits gap analysis. Like, these are the people that work for you that you're spending all this money on via the 83%. And here's what you need to offer them to get them to stay. Because employers very simply want to recruit, retain and engage employees. Period. End of story. They don't give a shit about CITs. And I'll drink because I needed to say that [58:47] JD: I love it when our guests cuss it. I'm psyched on that. Spell it out for the, for the viewers today. Like so of course you can get data from the record keep. Of course you get data from the TPA kind of census. You get data directly from the plan sponsor. But you're. And that's okay. And you're not excluding that. Oh, sorry. All right, I'll drink. Hang on there, Will and Jeremy. [59:10] Chad: But you're also talking about getting it [59:12] JD: more from, I would kind of say a non 401k traditional sense. Right. Like real conspiracy data. Like about whether these people have a dog or whether they're married or whether they live in, you know, here or there or their shopping habits or I don't know what. Right. You're kind of going in that area. [59:31] Speaker E: Yeah, that's right. But it's not to out anybody because they shop at Walmart or you know, that kind of stuff. It's to understand their needs and to, you know, communicate with them and connect with them at the right times in their life, which is when life events happen and it's more about that. And again, for the employer, you got to Connect your employees to your organization. You have to be able to bring them in, keep them there and engage them. And without the right data, you can't do that. And when you think about data, what's hampered advisors is just like the wrong data, the volume of data, the speed of it, the types, the privacy, the regulatory, there's all these things, right? We think we're working on something that solves all that and makes it scalable and usable so that advisors can do what they do best, which is, you know, help people make better decisions. And that helps the employer because again, they're spending a ton of money on their employees and they need them engaged and they need them focused and they need them to be productive. [1:00:35] Speaker B: And in some of our prior conversations we got into where you're getting the data from, what data you're getting, what the outcome is from getting that data. And I think we're missing that right now in the conversation. You hit on it a second ago. You want to help the average participant. And that average participant has different needs, very different needs. Whether it is a young employee that makes 30 grand a year, someone who's been in the workforce for 20 or 30 years and making 130 grand a year, their needs are very different. And what you're saying is the data we're getting, and you post it on LinkedIn, we keep striving for the wrong data. You're saying it has nothing to do with the plan. It really is not data you're getting from the client. And one of the questions asked is the data you're getting a plan asset. You're saying we're getting data that will actually allow advisors to make an impact on everybody's well being within the plan, whether that person needs a emergency savings fund or needs access to a trust. You're saying that the data you're getting is more holistic and is going to allow you to build almost a financial plan plan in a, in a tech efficient way for everybody. Am I right in that? [1:01:47] Speaker E: Seriously, this guy, I mean he doesn't just know cash balance now, but I'll joke site. Yeah, it's no employee left behind. [1:01:54] Mark: Right? [1:01:55] Speaker E: I mean, let's just start with the obvious. Average 401k plan, 30% aren't even in the plan. Why are they not in the plan? Said company offers a safe harbor, beautiful match. These people aren't in. Why? There's reasons why they're not in. Right. And we know it's not just access. Yeah, life gets in the way. So here's the thing. No employee left behind. The organization needs to know how to help serve the lower, middle and higher incomes because all of them are important for different reasons. Our system is just going to give visibility to all those groups again with the advisor driving the result and being able to report back to that employer. I'm going to give you an ROI on this massive spend that you have no visibility. [1:02:46] Chad: Return on investment. [1:02:47] JD: I think some people out there are kind of wondering, like, where, where is this data coming from? It's a third party source or. [1:02:56] Speaker E: Yeah, so we have a technology partner that's, that's a master of pulling together publicly available data. So they've been doing a lot of things for the government for the past eight years. And we've partnered with them and developed something that we're bringing to this industry. [1:03:14] JD: And I think the way that advisors should look at it, you guys, is that I can walk into a prospect or a client and I can tell them things about their employees that they don't know. And then I can structure my solutions to them based on that data and those things that I know about their people. And that's the impressive moment I'm looking for. Right where that, that HR person or that CFO is like, holy shit. Like we didn't know that about our own staff. Dang it. And now you're telling us. We'll take this to the after show. [1:03:48] Chad: I want to get the cbc. Damn it. [1:03:51] JD: That's two. [1:03:53] Chad: Great. All right, got it. [1:03:54] JD: Justin, who's your vote for a chat bar champ Champion. [1:03:58] Speaker C: Oh, I'm going with Jeremy tonight. [1:04:02] Speaker B: Jeremy. [1:04:03] JD: Cool. Yeah. [1:04:04] Speaker C: Yep. [1:04:05] JD: This is fucking cool. He just. I was gonna get my vote. Mark, who's your vote for chopper champion into the finals? [1:04:13] Mark: I'm going to vote not based upon what was said, but the fact that I know that Brad is in a car driving down the interstate. [1:04:24] JD: Fair enough. [1:04:25] Mark: And chiming in. [1:04:26] Speaker C: Brad. [1:04:26] Speaker E: Brad. [1:04:27] Speaker G: Brad gets my vote. [1:04:28] Speaker B: Brad. [1:04:29] Chad: Brandon, we got my turn. Brandon, we got Jeremy and Brad. Chad, go ahead. [1:04:33] Speaker B: I was going to say Brad as well. Now that he's in the finals, I'm going to leave him out. I. I'm debating between Nevin and Sherry because when they jumped on, everybody got all giddy. Not only us on the show. You saw the chat bar to start to blow up. Oh, my God. [1:04:48] Mark: Sherry here. [1:04:49] Chad: It's Nevin. [1:04:50] Speaker B: Nevin's in the house, so I'm gonna go. Sherry. Sorry. Nevin. Sherry gets it tonight. [1:04:57] Chad: I was gonna go. [1:04:58] JD: That's great because I'm gonna go. Nevin. I. I feel like Nevin Asks really smart things and he's not afraid to give his opinion. We just got to get him on again and have him be that, that courageous and bold. He's. He's a fan. Even though I ripped on him on his podcast today. I'm sorry about that, Nevin. Brett, your vote for chat bar champion to the finals. [1:05:19] Speaker E: Sir Robert Cruz. [1:05:20] Chad: Oh, nice. Okay. Yeah, Brandon, that's a lot of them. That's a lot of them. [1:05:26] JD: But hopefully you're taking those in and [1:05:28] Chad: throwing them up there. [1:05:29] JD: And now you, the audience will choose who's going to win all the cash and prizes of chat bar champion for today. [1:05:39] Chad: I had a lot of fun, by [1:05:40] JD: the way, looking back at all the past chat bar champions and I get a vote. [1:05:45] Chad: I've just realized that I'm the only [1:05:46] JD: one that can see these results. All along I thought everyone could see this little screen, but just. But just me. So I'm watching the votes come in. It's pretty close so far. Pretty close. But I have to say that Sherry and Nevin are definitely leading the pack. Come on, people. [1:06:05] Chad: There's still a lot. [1:06:06] JD: We need more votes coming in. [1:06:08] Chad: You use your mouse, you click on [1:06:09] JD: the little clicky clicker thing. [1:06:11] Chad: You can do this. [1:06:12] Speaker B: I will say the voting when you're [1:06:13] Speaker G: on your cell phone is more difficult because it doesn't just pop up like normal. [1:06:17] Speaker E: Wow, look at those numbers. [1:06:19] JD: We got a three way tie, bro. It's close. [1:06:24] Chad: Right on, Brandon. Brandon's putting it up on the screen [1:06:27] JD: so everyone can see it. [1:06:28] Mark: Don't do that because that influences people. [1:06:30] Speaker B: Oh, look at Mark. [1:06:33] Chad: Sherry's won before. [1:06:34] JD: Not get in there and vote. [1:06:35] Speaker G: I don't know. You not want Sherry to win. [1:06:37] Chad: All right. [1:06:38] Speaker C: Oh, you voted for Brad. [1:06:38] JD: Never mind, I'm done. You're done. If you haven't voted better yet it in. I'm about to shut this thing down. [1:06:44] Chad: Oh, Cruiserry Fitz. [1:06:46] JD: Sherry Fitz again. She's won before. [1:06:49] Chad: Sherry Fitz. [1:06:50] JD: End it. [1:06:51] Speaker E: Yep. [1:06:51] Chad: Sherry Switcher, cat bar champion. [1:06:54] JD: Way to go. I was rooting for you, Nevin. Loss again. Evan says loss again. Damn it. Can we share the results? I don't know how this whole share results thing goes back and forth. Forth. [1:07:04] Chad: What the fuck? [1:07:04] JD: Brandon, help me out. Okay. [1:07:06] Chad: We're ending the show with a little song. And Even though the Hero7 guys thought [1:07:11] JD: that they somehow chose the music, that's not how it works around here. [1:07:15] Chad: They were, they were sending me emails like, oh, we want to play this music. [1:07:18] JD: And I was, I wrote them back. [1:07:19] Chad: I'm like, who the fuck told you, [1:07:21] JD: you choose the songs. You don't choose the songs. [1:07:23] Chad: It's Mark's turn to choose the music. [1:07:25] Mark: They could have wrote me, and I would have let them choose it. [1:07:28] Chad: So, Mark, what did you choose? Or don't tell us what. [1:07:31] JD: But can you give us a little insight on your. Your emotions here, your inspiration? [1:07:35] Speaker E: I. [1:07:35] Mark: You know, you asked me to dig down deep, and I decided not to. [1:07:38] Speaker E: I kept it real simple and I [1:07:40] Mark: went with the song. Yeah, you know, I will fuck you. I went with a song that. All it does is give positive vibes only. [1:07:50] Speaker G: Oh, God. [1:07:52] Mark: Vibe.