Brad Ahrens: Full-Service vs. Niche Advisory | Retireholics

[0:00] Justin: Is there such things like tofu turkey? [0:02] Chad: Yeah, we had a little. We had a little, like, plant based kind of chicken style thing, but. But we cooked it. My wife cooked a turkey because my kids are carnivores, bro. So. [0:14] JD: My kids. [0:16] Chad: My kids and my chihuahuas. [0:18] Mark: Excuse me. What the hell? Where did you get that? [0:23] Justin: Mark? [0:24] Brad Ahrens: Let me just. Let me just show you the new. The new dreads here. [0:26] Mark: Oh, that's a rope. [0:28] Speaker F: Got a new ro. [0:33] JD: Oh, no. [0:34] Chad: I thought you had a shirt. [0:35] Mark: That's amazing. [0:36] JD: 401. Jake sent you a robe. [0:39] Mark: Yeah, I was. I. I knew I'd seen that. Okay, who. Whose logo is that? [0:44] Brad Ahrens: Yeah, I. [0:46] Speaker F: He sent it. [0:47] Mark: Good. [0:48] Brad Ahrens: He sent it to me last week. [0:50] Speaker F: Mark. [0:51] Brad Ahrens: Blown away. [0:52] Chad: Can I ask you a serious question? Where are your other sponsors on your robe? [0:58] Brad Ahrens: Hold on, dude. [0:58] Mark: I. [1:00] Brad Ahrens: First off, I'm doing this and wearing this because I feel like Jake sending it over to me was like, that's so cool, him wanting to be, like, the primary sponsor. But I'm not, like, disowning my tried and true grassroots sponsors who started this all. But I can't wear two robes at once while sitting next to Chad because he makes me sweat as is. [1:23] Justin: So. [1:24] Speaker F: Yeah. The office is so hot right now. [1:25] Brad Ahrens: It was just an unveiling of the new robe. Yeah, the other Brandon. [1:29] JD: Brandon. [1:29] Chad: That's the best. That's the best most appropriate graphic I've ever seen in my life. [1:34] Brad Ahrens: The old robe is at the dry cleaner. [1:40] JD: Wow. [1:41] Speaker F: Pull those patches off the old robe and throw it on this. [1:43] Justin: Brad, you understand a lick of what's going on right now or not really. [1:47] Mark: I know there's an undertone here someplace that dates back at least a couple episodes, I'm guessing. [1:57] Brad Ahrens: Yeah. It's been a long time, Eric. [1:58] JD: Maybe you want to give me a [1:59] Chad: heads up when you. When you pull stuff like that. Because it just so happens that I'm singing a song today about your robe. That's at the cleaners. But that's all right. [2:12] Speaker F: He's got his robe on. [2:14] JD: J.D. [2:14] Brad Ahrens: come on, buddy. You're like the master marketer here. You should feel like that. That is a perfect thing to happen now that I have a new road. [2:23] Chad: Nice. [2:23] JD: I mean, I don't understand, like, that's. [2:25] Brad Ahrens: It's a great lever. [2:29] Mark: So how much prep time does it take to do every episode? I mean, is it three minutes ago? [2:36] Chad: For Justin, Chad, and Mark, it takes zero fucking minutes. [2:42] JD: And for Brandon, for me, it's a [2:45] Chad: couple hours throughout the week. You know, I try to do my homework on you, you know, and try to build out kind of the basic agenda. [2:52] JD: And Brannon spends every waking moment of [2:54] Chad: his life preparing for these shows. [2:57] Mark: I wake up at the crack of 11, pound a pot of coffee, and then I prep. [3:04] Speaker F: You're probably fine, right? [3:05] Mark: No, I don't want these. [3:06] Speaker F: Brad. There was a point in time where these shows did require a significant amount of prep because we would be traveling somewhere, and that would eat up time and flights and getting situated. Then we would drink the night before, which would mean we were up later the next day. Now, that doesn't happen. J.D. and Brandon do it all, and we show up. I call us the talent. [3:26] Chad: Yeah, the live shows were a little more. A lot more going on with that. [3:29] JD: Hey, if guys want to throw in [3:31] Chad: some football before we get started, I think Dan Harding, was Mark referring to you and saying, go Niners. And Nevin is saying, Justin, Packer fans should be smiling this week. [3:45] Brad Ahrens: I. I got nothing to say. After the Raiders got their ass kicked by Atlanta, so. [3:50] Speaker F: Understatement. [3:51] Mark: We have some Packer fans on here. [3:53] Justin: That's like the packers losing to the Vikings earlier this year. [3:57] Chad: Yeah, Justin is on the same. [3:59] Brad Ahrens: Because they're in the same division. [4:00] Speaker F: Justin, that's not even. [4:01] Justin: They were one in five, Mark. [4:04] Brad Ahrens: Doesn't matter. That's why they play the game. [4:07] Speaker F: Justin, I just want to say that the Giants are in first place. So all I can say [4:14] JD: that beat [4:15] Brad Ahrens: the Chiefs this year and almost beat them a second time. [4:20] Justin: What'd you say, Brad? [4:22] Mark: Yeah, the Giants are in first place with. What is it, a three and five or three and six record four and seven now. [4:33] Brad Ahrens: I think. [4:34] Speaker F: I think we're four and seven now. Leading the division. [4:37] JD: Right? Leading the division. [4:40] Speaker F: Josh, you can't talk crap about our division because you've been in a down division for, like, 44 years. B. Is our mic okay? [4:51] Chad: Yeah. You sound great. [4:53] Mark: I can hear myself a little bit out of somebody. Maybe it's me. [4:59] Chad: God, the sun's right behind my monitor, and then it just drops out of the sky and all my lighting changes. [5:05] Speaker F: Justin, your mic was pretty bad a minute ago. Like, high, low. [5:10] Mark: Oh, fine. [5:12] Speaker F: Right now. [5:12] Mark: Sound good? I am hearing myself through myself. [5:16] Justin: Yeah, I'm Getting Echo on YouTube. [5:21] Chad: Two minutes till showtime. [5:26] Speaker F: JD did you get my. Did you get my forewarning voicemail today? [5:31] Brad Ahrens: Yeah. [5:32] Chad: Have you seen anything on the news yet? [5:33] Speaker F: Yeah, they announced it, like, one. [5:36] Justin: I haven't seen anything down here. Have you, J.D. [5:39] Chad: i haven't looked. [5:40] Brad Ahrens: I haven't looked. [5:40] Speaker F: I've been in here five regions, talked about how and when he's not yet. [5:48] Chad: PCH is trying to build my confidence for the show starts. JD sucks. Just want to throw it out there. [5:57] Speaker F: Judy does suck. [5:59] Mark: What is this? [6:02] Brad Ahrens: Yeah, hide me. Just make sure. No, I'm just doing it so I can chat. [6:07] Chad: Michael. Oh, Shamanda loves me. PCH loves me, too. That's just his way of saying it. [6:14] Speaker F: By the way, I was trying to remember, who was it? Was it Renee? Was it Shamanda? The teammates that told us to eat bread, that their strategy was to eat the bread before the show. [6:26] Chad: I think it was Shamanda. [6:27] Speaker F: Yeah, I can't remember who it was, but I actually had a loaf of bread before coming out here. So our slice. [6:33] Chad: Yeah, Brad figured it out. Gavin's shutting down the state again. Yep. Gavin went to have a little dinner at the French Laundry and decided to shut it all down again. [6:44] Justin: About that comment about supporting small businesses. [6:48] Chad: I haven't seen any of it. [6:49] Brad Ahrens: No. [6:50] Mark: For California, what is it? Gyms all close now. Again. [6:56] Justin: So today, clubs are open. [6:59] Speaker F: They divided the state into five regions, Brad. And if the intensive care bed number gets below 15% availability, then they shut down the region. So they said within 48 hours, four of the five regions will be shut down, which means bars, restaurants. They listed barbershops, salons, TPA firms, parks, things like that will all close back down. [7:29] Mark: Well, our governor a week ago shut down all bars, restaurants, gyms, and suspended all youth sports. And all schools are remote now, and for a month, it goes until the 18th of December, at which time it will be examined again. And we were under strict instructions. In fact, I believe it's a misdemeanor to have guests come in our homes, even at Thanksgiving. It was, though, you could do it with the possibility of a misdemeanor and a thousand dollar fine. Now, I don't think any police force in the state was enforcing that, but that's kind of where it is here in Minnesota. [8:16] Chad: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here we go. Brand's starting it. I'm gonna throw that one in. Zoominar and chill. Zoominar and chill. Welcome, everybody, to another episode of Retireholics. My name is Jay to the dizzle. I'm here with Chad, I'm here with Mark and Justone. And we've got a special guest which we will introduce in just a second before we do that if December. [9:08] JD: So I thought I could sing a [9:10] Chad: little holiday song for you all to [9:13] Speaker F: start the show back on. [9:14] Chad: Hang on. [9:15] Speaker F: Put that. That striped beanie back on. Everybody will love it. [9:24] Mark: The hell are we getting ourselves into? [9:27] Brad Ahrens: All Right. [9:28] Chad: This doesn't really fit me that well, [9:29] JD: but it's the only Santa hat I [9:31] Chad: had at the house, so. Ho ho, ho and merry Christmas. I wrote you guys a song to kick off the show. Let's see if I can get through it. [9:40] JD: Here we go. [9:40] Chad: And a 1, 2, 3. [9:43] JD: Marky the rogue guy is a jolly drunken fool With a dirty robe and a half drunk beer and several patches [9:54] Chad: for which he sold his soul. [9:57] JD: Marky the rogue guy is a creepy tale. [10:00] Chad: They say his robe is never washed. But the advisors know how it came to life one day. [10:11] JD: There must have been some magic in [10:13] Chad: that old dirty robe he found. [10:17] JD: For when he placed it on his bod, he began to thrash around, kind [10:23] Chad: of like in an evil way. [10:25] JD: Then Marky the robe guy, he saw a pep pooled employer plan standing there. He got so mad that he shoved its face into the snowy ground and began to pull its hair. Now Marky the robe guy, well, he beat the shit out of that stupid pep. Now the pep knows to stay away [10:50] Chad: because Marky, he just don't play. [10:54] Brad Ahrens: Yay. [10:58] Speaker F: Time and effort put into that, Judy. [11:03] Brad Ahrens: Wow. Wow. [11:04] Justin: I mean, it was something else. [11:07] Speaker F: Something else. [11:08] JD: Thanks. [11:08] Chad: Happy holidays. Happy holidays, everybody. [11:11] Brad Ahrens: Okay, some things you want to talk about. [11:14] Speaker F: J.D. super excited about pets. [11:17] Chad: I could talk about Pepsi. [11:20] Brad Ahrens: Well, hold on. Can I just address the. The elephant robe in the room? [11:25] Chad: Please do. [11:25] Brad Ahrens: Okay. So I just saw Jake hopped on too, so it's perfect timing. So thank you, 401Jake, for the new robe digs and the hundreds of thousands of sponsorship dollars you're sending my way. Just a keynote to the rest of my sponsors that my first robe, the original, the OG it's going to go into the 401k hall of Fame. So just know that it's at the dry cleaners right now. So that's nice and perfect and it's gonna go there. But I will, I will bring the patches back onto the new robe. There was just so many comments from people I'm around about how smelly it was that I had to. Jake did us all a favor and he got me this new robe which has his 401 club. [12:16] Speaker F: Wrong one. [12:16] JD: 401 club on it. [12:18] Brad Ahrens: So you can see it. I'm really not good at this yet. And then of course, a little added touch here. [12:25] Speaker F: Raider Nation. Raider Nation. [12:26] Brad Ahrens: So thank you, 401Jake, for being a new sponsor of the robe. And to my other sponsors, 401K Fridays, NPPG Advisor 2X, Genie Fisher and Short Fat. I love you all. You will be Back on the robe momentarily. [12:46] JD: God, you write a song about robe guy, it all goes to his head [12:49] Chad: and he won't shut up. [12:51] JD: All right, well done. Nice robe. Let's do a little housekeeping. Housekeeping. [12:59] Speaker F: Housekeeping. [13:01] Mark: No, thank you. Sleeping. [13:04] JD: All right, make sure you're in gallery view. You know where that is? It's up there in the top. Hover your mouse over it. Find it. And so you can see us all at the same time. And of course, we've been two weeks off. [13:14] Chad: We were off last week, so there was no chat bar champion last week. We are definitely going to have a chat bar champion. [13:21] JD: So, Brad, please try to pay attention [13:23] Chad: to that chat bar. You're going to have to vote for someone at the end of the show. Whoever was the smartest, the funniest, the wittiest, you know, whatever, whatever toots your horn that you're into, vote for that person and they will get all kinds of glorious cash and prizes sent to their home and or office. [13:41] JD: Prohibitive word. Brad, do you know what the prohibitive word is? [13:44] Speaker F: Damn. Okay, we got Scott. [13:46] Mark: I was trying to think in advance what it possibly could be, but I've come up with. I'm not exactly sure, but you know [13:52] Chad: the concept of the prohibitive word. [13:54] Mark: I do. Every time I say it, I have to take a drink. [13:57] JD: You got to take a drink of something. Hopefully something nasty. A very stiff mixed drink or a shot from something. [14:03] Chad: I'm back to the classic Gregis. What do you got there, Chad? [14:07] Speaker F: I actually forgot, but thankfully I've got plenty of liquor that just stays in my office. So I've got a bottle of 14 year Glen Fiddich single malt scotch. [14:16] Chad: Very nice. Very nice. [14:18] JD: I watched you do an interview, Brad, [14:21] Chad: with John Sullivan at 401k specialist, and in the course of about two and a half minutes, you said the word plan like 35 times. So we're gonna. [14:31] JD: We're gonna go with P, L, A, N as a prohibitive word. And I'm not. [14:38] Chad: Do I have to drink for that? [14:40] Speaker F: No, that was your first one. [14:42] Chad: There's nothing there. I got my stuff over there, so. And I have reserved the right to add a second word at the halfway mark. [14:50] Brad Ahrens: Yeah. [14:51] Chad: Nope, not talking. [14:52] JD: Oh, let's. Oh, I didn't even give a proper. [14:56] Brad Ahrens: Hey, what's the word? [14:57] JD: P, L, A, N. I don't know how to spell. [15:01] Speaker F: That kind of counts. We said spelling counts, by the way. [15:04] Mark: So this affects not only me, it affects you guys, too. [15:09] Chad: Yes, it will. It will. [15:12] Brad Ahrens: If you sponsor my robe and Commit to it right now. I'll drink for you. [15:17] Mark: So what's that take to sponsor your robe? [15:19] Brad Ahrens: You don't want to know. [15:22] JD: Let's. You know, I didn't give you. You know, we've got our very cool guest on. [15:26] Chad: We got Mr. Brad Ahrens, the CEO founder of IntelliSense. [15:31] JD: And I should have created some big, [15:33] Chad: cool, glamorous introduction for you, but I was too busy coming up with a Frosty the Snowman song, so I couldn't do that. [15:41] Brad Ahrens: Priorities are straight for you, buddy. [15:44] JD: Well, we are psyched to have you here. I believe that you've got a really [15:49] Chad: cool perspective given the history of everything that you've done and how your career has evolved. And so I'm feeling pretty cool about some things. We could tap into your brain today and have some discussion. So we'll get started with some of that. But before we dive in, give everyone a little bit of the history of Brad in terms of where you started this whole ABG thing and then selling, I believe the record keeping stuff and then focusing on advisor stuff and then going to intelligence. Give us a kind of a quick summary of how you've gotten to where you are today and where it all started. [16:27] Mark: Well, I'm basically second generation in a family business that was started by my father and another gentleman shortly after the passage of Orissa. This gentleman came to my father who was a college professor and basketball coach. And he wasn't a college professor in finance or anything like that, he was teaching kinesiology, so the sciences. And this guy came to him and said there's this new out there's. There's this new law out there. Erisa. I don't know anything about it, but nobody else does. I think we should become pension planners to make a long story. Oh gosh, take a little swig. I'm have to come up with some sort of strategy on another word for. [17:21] Speaker F: Gotta write them down, Brad. [17:24] Mark: Anyway, they, they an insurance company taught them how to do DBs and they went out and my, my father was from Iowa, his partner was from Minnesota and they had a. What was called a secretary at that time. And my dad went down and put in DB plans for rural banks. Iowa [17:53] JD: number two [17:56] Mark: under the premise that if you got the local bank, you were also going to get the local businesses. His partner who was from Minnesota went and did the same thing there and they formed a company that was called Independent service company and it became quite successful. It did. At that time I was merely in junior high. Didn't really know what My dad did. I really knew what he did when he was coach because I used to tag him along all the time and I'm an ex jock. But to make a long story short, that partnership grew. A business with about 20 employees was successful. But that partnership split up in 1984, the year I was graduating from law school. I interned for the company for several summers and it was always made clear that I would be welcome back. But I really thought I'd go out and kind of make my own way, at least for a period of time. But at that time, when I was graduating from law school, my dad needed me. I went back and I was the fifth employee and what at that time was called Aaron's Associates. [19:09] JD: Here I was, here I was about [19:11] Chad: to just put all this praise on [19:13] JD: you as this icon entrepreneur who's grown this business. And you're just like me. You're just a loser who took over your dad's company. [19:22] Mark: He deserves a lot of the credit, he really does, because he was very, you know, that was a business that was basically started to feed his family. And it grew into a real business. It did. I was the fifth employee of Aaron's Associates. And I came back to basically [19:41] Speaker F: be [19:41] Mark: his slave, more or less. You know, I was a graduate of law school. I was. I took the Minnesota bar and passed it. And yet I came back and really at that time was. Was the termination of 401ks and became involved in terminating DB plans. [20:03] Chad: That's exciting. [20:07] Mark: 401k plan? [20:08] Speaker F: Beats me. [20:09] JD: There's another one. Take him up the floor. But you grew that. You grew your dad's business to like, [20:18] Chad: I mean, 120 plus employees or something at a certain point, right. [20:23] Mark: To pick it at 141 people. [20:26] JD: As much as I love to reminisce [20:27] Chad: about your early years, let's keep it moving forward. So you grow that puppy. And where are we? We're getting into 2000. When did you sell the ABG record keeping portion? When was that? [20:44] Mark: Almost exactly five years ago. January. [20:46] Chad: Years ago. [20:47] Mark: January 1st of 2016. [20:49] JD: And it was like $6 billion in assets. [20:54] Chad: What was that like how many plans? Like 1500 plans. 2000 plans. [21:02] JD: Unlike you, Brad, I don't take a sip for my beer. I take a shot of vodka. [21:08] Mark: I'll eventually get my scotch up. I've just tried to pace myself and figure out how to stay sane through this whole thing. Anyway, we had about 900 retirement programs, nice retirement programs. We had over 1,000 HSA clients. We had put together our own HSA program way back in the year the law was passed, which would have been in like 2004. And we put that together and marketed that through health insurance agents who basically decided where that was going to go. And we record kept that custody it at Schwab and really grew a nice business there. In fact we sold that as part of our record keeping. And that was one of the reasons that we became attracted or attractive to this suitor is because we got them in the HSA business. We also were processing payroll at that time and we had, oh, I don't know, we probably had five or six hundred flex plans. Flex plate, [22:27] JD: that's two extra ones. So you and your, your brother was [22:33] Chad: involved as well, right? [22:35] Mark: Yes, I'm, I'm. We were co founders of IntelliSense. [22:40] JD: Okay. [22:40] Chad: Okay. [22:41] JD: So you and your brother helped get [22:43] Chad: it to this 6 billion and these 900 plans and all these HSAs and you sold it? Yeah, I'll get to that. Well, I just wanted you to know and everyone to know my brother and I have also grown a Wonderful Beer Drinking YouTube show. [22:58] JD: So don't think you're so fucking fancy. [23:01] Chad: Right. [23:01] JD: Brandon, when you sold that, I had [23:05] Chad: some questions for you. How much did you sell it for? What is your current net worth and what kind of Lambo do you drive? [23:16] Mark: Well, I can tell you that, that we sold the record keeping division, but we purposely did not sell the advisory practice. The advisory practice was the part of the business that I grew up on that my dad basically started and that my brother grew up on. We were very, very fortunate in that at an early stage we knew that none of the Aarons should be managing or overseeing the record keeping side of the practice. That wasn't our strength. And so we found a partner that ended up being president of that division. We made him an equal partner and collectively my dad over the course of time had retired and the three of us built what in the beginning was a stepsister business. Basically designed to just do record keeping for the clients that my dad brought through the door. And then I brought it in the door and my brother brought in the door and we eventually turned it into a shop that worked with outside advisors too. [24:31] JD: Because growing, you're growing that record keeping [24:34] Chad: shop, you're working with other advisors, but you're still maintaining your own book of business. Then you go to sell the record keeping, you decide to hang on to the advisor shop, which becomes intellisense and, and stick with that. Was that a strategic. You said you didn't feel like the record keeping was the right fit for you, obviously that's pretty complicated stuff. But did you also just feel like there's, there's a lot more success to be had in the advisor world versus the record keeping world? Which seems pretty logical to say that, right? [25:07] Mark: We were at a point where we needed to, we needed to look at alternative record keeping platforms other than our PC based platform. You know, we had plans that just [25:28] JD: needed more horsepower than you had. [25:30] Mark: They were big, they were big programs that needed more horsepower that you know, if we were going to process of payroll that came electronically to it to us, you know, it might take all night. We turn it on when we left and it processed it during the night in order to process that contribution. And we just, you know, the cost of that upgrade was going to be millions of dollars. And you know, quite frankly it was just something that we sat back and said, are we really going to do that or is now a good time to look for somebody that's already made that expenditure and that can basically take our clients and solve the problem for us? And that's what we did. [26:18] Speaker F: And you make it sound like the transition was a byproduct of choosing not to do the record keeping. I initially thought it was just so forward thinking that as an industry now most people are catching up saying, oh, it's not about the services to the business, it's about the services to the individuals. And that's where the financial advisor's really taken form. [26:40] Mark: Right. [26:40] Speaker F: In the last call it 10 years, 15 years. Back then it was all about services that you could deliver to the business. I feel like you were forward thinking enough to get ahead of that curve, but you're almost making it sound like it was by accident that you dumped the record keeping side and pushed heavy into the personal service side. [26:57] JD: Fantastic. [26:59] Mark: I would say that a lot of record keepers today that also have an advisory arm, that advisory arm is to some extent a stepsister business to the recordkeeping platform. That was not the case with us. I mean our advisory practice was extremely strong. I mean we were very progressive. Have we gone past that today? Yes, we have. We've grown dramatically. But we had an extremely strong advisory practice even when we were a record keeper, which sometimes conflicted with the record keeper and the advisors that were bringing us programs. But we were doing participant based services, giving advice into 401. [27:50] Speaker F: Part of what Intellisense is and what I'm sure we're going to get into is, is what you're delivering in a full financial package to a participant. Back then you weren't doing that right. I mean, you were doing financial guidance around the plan. Financial picture, were you? [28:09] Mark: We were giving advice at the program level. [28:14] Speaker F: Yeah. [28:16] Mark: Two participants, not just to the plan sponsor. We were giving advice, not just guidance. [28:22] Speaker F: Yeah. [28:23] Chad: That's one Brad. That's one Brad for the. [28:25] Speaker F: I'm genuinely interested in. As we, as we've chatted with other aggregators. I'm not going to call you an [28:33] JD: aggregator, but ask them, are they, Chad? [28:35] Chad: But are they? [28:36] Speaker F: I don't think so, based on what I've read. But as we chat with other aggregators and they're pulling all these different advisory groups together, most of them are taking the record keeping and saying it's time to get into the participant services and they're looking at all the data and all the axis because they know that most of the financial planning that the average American is going to get access to is going to be through. It's going to be through their company, through their business. And I'm seeing most of the financial institutions start to instill that side of the financial planning business. [29:12] JD: We're going to talk a lot about that. We're going to talk a lot about [29:15] Chad: that after the break. I'm going to dive deep into all these different things that you guys are offering. But can I back up Chad there before we get into all those other services and ask you, when we say aggregator, you know what we're talking about, right? Kind of like the SRPs and the resources investment advisors. Are you an aggregator? Are you running around the country trying to add advisors to the intellisense umbrella? [29:42] Mark: Yes. [29:43] Chad: See? [29:45] Speaker F: Are you buying their book or are you bringing them on under the family chassis? Because I couldn't tell. [29:50] Mark: I'm buying a part of their book. Yeah, okay, you are their book. And making them a branch office of [29:56] Chad: IntelliSense, they're just like resources. Not just like. Sorry. They are a similar model to those. But that's interesting. I thought that's kind of what I was sniffing out. I'm like, Chad, at first I'm like, oh no, there's something different. But as I dug in, I got that you were. But I do feel like you're ahead of the curve with intellect. IntelliSense. All my money, LifeSteps, all my benefits. IntelliSense University K Series. [30:26] JD: And we are going to talk about that. [30:27] Chad: You really have developed a lot of things. [30:31] JD: But before we do that, Brandon, let's spin a very fair wheel of ice that any one of us could lose. [30:39] Chad: Except for you. Brad, you are off the hook here. And if we lose, we have got to drink. [30:43] JD: We got a pound of steel. [30:45] Brad Ahrens: Do you have a regular size one today? [30:47] Chad: No, it's all the big ones. [30:48] Speaker F: Is Brandon included on the. [30:50] Justin: Everybody? [30:52] Chad: Sure. [30:53] Mark: I'm on the regular wheel. [30:55] Justin: Oh, beautiful. [30:56] JD: All right, so spin that wheel, and [30:58] Chad: then I would like to talk about 401k fashion for just a moment. No, no. [31:17] Brad Ahrens: Well, someone's gonna have to talk now. [31:19] JD: Okay, this is gonna. [31:20] Chad: This is gonna take me like, three hours. [31:22] Mark: Yeah. [31:23] Brad Ahrens: All right, before our next topic, before [31:26] JD: I pound this, let me get you started. I want to talk about fashion for a variety of reasons. But before I do, I want to get in. I'm going to do a little wardrobe [31:35] Chad: change, you know, to get in the mood for fashion. [31:37] Justin: Oh, here we go. [31:40] JD: Hey, got a little scarf here. [31:42] Speaker F: Do you see the recommendation from Josh Lajoy that there should be a chat barf on the wheel of ice and the whole chat bar has to drink a wheel. [31:51] Chad: Oh, I like that hipster hat. [31:55] Speaker F: Oh, my goodness. [31:57] Chad: Some glasses. [32:00] JD: So that doesn't look very stylish. When we were researching [32:09] Chad: Brad here, I mean, some of the shots that were [32:13] JD: coming up, you can see the one here he's wearing. [32:15] Chad: I can't even call it a vest, because that doesn't give it justice. It looks like wool with some cool pockets. I don't know if anyone watches Peaky Blinders, but I think if you threw [32:24] JD: one of those hats on him, he [32:25] Chad: could join the Netflix show. [32:28] JD: We also saw other deals where he [32:29] Chad: had cool, like, Levi jackets on, and he was like a man out in the rugged Minnesota fields, working. Look at him now. Look at the jacket he's got got on. He's sporting some, like, distressed leather thing [32:43] Mark: with a get up and give us a twirl. [32:46] JD: Can we see the ste. [32:49] Mark: And what about the shirt? [32:50] Speaker F: I heard about the shirt, too. It looks like it's got. [32:52] Brad Ahrens: Does that say off your shirt? [32:55] Chad: No. [32:56] JD: Does it? Yeah. Love it. [33:06] Justin: Wait, hold on. [33:07] Brad Ahrens: Hey, is this the same shirt you wore while talking to Ross Marino on Outcomes Podcast? [33:12] Mark: Yes. [33:14] Brad Ahrens: We gotta get some new clothes, buddy. [33:16] Mark: Well, actually, JD Requested it. You know, the funny thing is, we did it too. You know, Ross and I had a dry run for that podcast, and, you know, I was sheltering from home, and this is, you know, this is business formal for me right now. Throw a jean jacket on and I'm good to go. And when we, you know, he commented on my shirt, my T shirt at the time, and he goes, I want you to wear that during the podcast. And so I did. And JD Said, you know, put the Vest away. And how about Sadie next? [33:54] JD: I'm wearing this hat as a nod to your daughter Amanda. And I think Amanda's in the chat bar. She's got a very hipster cool picture [34:04] Chad: on the corporate website and she talks [34:07] JD: about being like a right brained woman [34:09] Chad: working in a left brained industry or something like that. [34:12] JD: So my question to you is, has [34:15] Chad: she dressed you for your career? [34:17] JD: Has she been an influence on you? Or is this fashion stuff that you got going on? I mean, look at the picture Brandon's got up. [34:24] Chad: Is this your own doing? [34:26] JD: And Amanda, feel free to chime in [34:28] Chad: via the chat bar. [34:29] Brad Ahrens: Jd, you should start drinking your ice, please. [34:32] JD: I'm gonna start drinking the bl. [34:34] Mark: To my mother. Actually, you're in charge of the show. You know, I mean, from the first I can remember, she. She was very stylish. She had a father. My mother grew up on a farm in central Iowa, and she. Her father, who was a big farmer, was very stylish, so to speak. That carried over to my mom, who was. Who is still a very stylish woman. And she had an influence on all of her children. Well, probably not as much on my brother Grant. He's kind of. He's kind of a. Just jeans and T shirts all the time. [35:13] Speaker F: If I take one step back and just start with your first comment, which is your mom still dresses you, it sounds pretty bad. [35:20] Mark: Well, she doesn't. She's had an influence, though. And then my wife is fairly stylish too, and that probably had an impact on my three daughters. So, yes, Amanda has her own style. There's no doubt about it. [35:40] Speaker F: Amanda must be chatting. Nobody can see your chatting, jd. [35:48] Brad Ahrens: I'm finishing that. I'm surprised and proud of you. [35:54] Speaker F: He can't hear you because his headphones [35:55] Brad Ahrens: are off right now. [35:58] Chad: Holy shit. [36:01] Speaker F: Welcome back, jd. [36:03] Brad Ahrens: Okay, Brad's been ragging on you the whole time. This is great. Anyways, welcome back, jd. [36:08] Chad: Thanks so. [36:09] JD: All right, we'll move on. But, Brad, I'm sure you figured out while I was drinking that you and I are the only fashion forward people. These guys don't know shit about fashion. Okay, let's move on. [36:19] Brad Ahrens: I wear. Dude, I wear robes on the show. [36:21] JD: Come on. [36:21] Brad Ahrens: Yeah, I don't know anything about that. [36:22] Speaker F: And on stage in front of 500 [36:24] Brad Ahrens: people, I just cleaned out my closet and I realized I have four shirts that I wear. That's about it. [36:30] Chad: I'm feeling like my blood sugar. [36:33] Mark: That's all you need. Really? [36:34] Speaker F: Do I need to call an ambulance for you, man? [36:36] Brad Ahrens: You're gonna be okay. [36:36] JD: I'm good, I'm good, I'm good. [36:39] Brad Ahrens: All right. [36:39] JD: Chad, you were about to touch on this. Brad had mentioned on a previous interview that the typical that he believes the typical American is going to get most [36:51] Chad: of the or the majority of their financial needs taken care of at their employer. [36:56] JD: And the 401k program is a, ha [37:00] Chad: ha, could be a phenomenal way to deliver all this stuff. [37:06] JD: And we're starting to see our industry [37:09] Chad: understand that and move towards that. [37:11] JD: I gotta feel like with all those [37:13] Chad: things I mentioned earlier and to tag along here, just go to IntelliSense and [37:18] JD: go to their you know what it [37:20] Chad: is that they do tab. You have all these cool little logos [37:24] JD: and all these cool little names of [37:25] Chad: these little tech tools and product offerings. So you clearly believe that you can deliver all things to these participants. How long ago did you see this as the vision? How has it been going? And then maybe we'll talk a little bit more about what we see in the future. But you're clearly all in on this concept. So tell us a little bit more about it. [37:49] Mark: Well, we started in the retirement business. That's the business we were in, 100% retirement. And what really changed, it was 401k. You know, prior to that time, everything was dictated by the employer and the employees didn't have to make any decisions, they didn't have any choices. And you know, a lot of people don't realize that at the same time 401k was coming into fashion, so was section 125 where you could make health insurance premiums pre tax. And that was the beginning of my career. And so we early on said this is going to complement our 401k practice if we get into group insurance. So from, you know, there is a lot of convergence going on right now between, you know, shops that like one digital and Hub that started out with commercial property casualty and health insurance programs, now going out and purchasing 401k guys and gals. We've had a group insurance capability since the 1980s. It's always been a smaller part of our advisory practice, but we always believe that it went hand in glove. And many of our clients used us in a bundled environment where we didn't just do one or the other, we did both of them. And what's new with IntelliSense is we were always advised by other people that said, you need to get into private wealth, you need to get into private wealth. And we were complicated enough. I mean, just look at it from a record keeping Standpoint, we were extremely complicated. We were already pretty complicated from an advisory standpoint. So we didn't do it today. We have jumped into private wealth with both feet. And it today is already our second largest business that we're in. We're basically in three core businesses today that are all centered on the employee benefit relationship and the belief that the typical American gets the vast majority of their financial needs taken care of at their place of employment. And so we already had all the benefits covered. What we needed. We had clients that told us, you know, Brad, you do a great job of getting our employees to retirement, but then you abandon them. Which we did. We abandoned. [40:11] Chad: I mean, we heard you talking about that on good old Ross Marino's show. Can I ask, do you think this is only a big firm solution? Like, you're a big shot, you know, you sold off. Now you're growing this thing to this massive national firm. So it makes sense to you. You've got the people, the personnel, the cash flow to like, you know, push into all these different areas. Can small advisors take a similar approach? And then lastly, let me ask you, is this only a solution for big plans? I mean, can you deliver all these [40:47] JD: little logos in this corner. [40:50] Chad: Thank you. To a 25 person $1.5 million plan? I mean, how do you see that? [41:00] Mark: Let's start first with what do you have to do to be able to deliver these three core businesses? You've got to build a bunch of stuff you do. And I think that takes money. There's no question about it. And that's just, I mean, there's pieces of technology out there that we had to purchase and then kind of build into all of those different services and products that we have to offer. What I think is going to happen is, is there is going to be a piece of technology that takes a bunch of the different technologies that I currently use to deliver that service and delivers it in one. And in fact that's going to be introduced here. There's an organization, it's actually E Money, the financial planning software that is going to take a number of that I have to use today. And I can wrap that up into one piece of software and deliver it to the employer in the form of a worksite financial wellness program that actually works instead of just looks good, you know, attached to 401k record keepers administrative platform. [42:23] Speaker F: The chat bar is, has. Has had some really good comments, one of which had to do with Autoverse taking action. And I saw that a lot on your website, which is, I'm of the believer that we can give as much information as we want but very few people are taking action. And so what has to happen from there is we either push them with some sort of auto feature, we give them a catalyst or we really stay with them from start to finish and we become an advocate for them. And what I saw through your website, your time with Ross and some of the other publications that I've read about, what you guys are doing is you're staying with them from start to finish and your goal is to truly be that advisor for them. The other thing that I'll mention J.D. i haven't told you this yet. Completely eye opening for me. I had a call with an advisor this week and he's buying private wealth leads which I don't talk to too many folks that are doing that. Usually I talk to folks who are buying 401k leads and he was telling me he's got this new client that's coming over, he's retiring, he's 56 years old, he's got about $5 million in investable assets and has no advisor. And my comment was wait, let me understand. Is he unhappy with his advisor so he's engaging you or he has no advisor? [43:37] Brad Ahrens: No, I'm not unhappy with that. [43:38] Speaker F: He has no. Like how does someone accumulate at the age of 50 years old 5 plus million dollar, 3 plus million dollars in investable assets and not have an advisor relationship? And it's because Brad mentioned it through sponsorship dollars. People are the advisor community is focused on the 401k side and not on the full financial picture. I didn't say and so it was eye opening to me that someone could be three plus million dollars of investable assets, not real estate, not not built up in a business and have nobody guiding them at an age of 55. And that's when I realized most of them are getting their guidance through the plan and that advisor is not going beyond the 401k space. Should I give mind blowing to give [44:28] Brad Ahrens: them one for that? Justin? [44:29] Mark: Yep, yep. If you're really, I'm really hung up on delivering A papers I call it, you know we don't put out passing grades here if we're not going to be in a business if we can't put out an A paper in that business. And when we first were looking at private wealth, I mean we were putting out a C paper at best and that's because we were trying to take 401k people and saying you're also going to become a private wealth person. And frankly, they just don't have time to do it. They don't. And so what we found is that if you want to respond to convergence of not just retirement and health, but now wealth, you got to go out and you've got to buy that talent, which is what we did. We went out and bought that talent. And what was the appeal of coming and joining us? We were going to introduce them to our 401k participants as part of our own worksite financial wellness program. That was not only going to get those employees to retirement, but now we were going to have the people that were going to get them through retirement. [45:42] Chad: You know what's cool about that? Brad, too. And to the audiences. I don't think you need to be a big fancy shop to do that. I think you could be a cool core 401k program advisor shop, decide you want to get into this and play like the big boys a little bit. [45:57] JD: You just got to hire someone who's. [45:59] Chad: Who's new and who's young and who's good and who's savvy, who's into it and is smart. And they want access to all those clients you have. I think there's a way for small shops to build on these solutions. [46:10] JD: You don't have to be big fancy [46:12] Chad: Brad to do it. [46:13] JD: Although maybe Brad's pitch to people across the country when they reach a certain [46:17] Chad: size is you probably help them scale a lot quicker if they come under your umbrella or like some of your [46:23] Speaker F: competitors as well, giving them the resources. [46:26] Chad: Right. [46:27] Mark: Let me give you an example. I mean, we have a branch office. We have branch offices from Minneapolis down to Kansas City, down to Dallas, Fort Worth. You know, we've got an office out in Seattle. We've got an office in Denver. But we have an office in Pella, Iowa, 60 miles from Des Moines, population 9,000. Why did we. And we've got an office. Think of Mayberry if you want to think of Mayberry. It's Pella, Iowa, beautiful community. It's got this beautiful center square, and we've got an intellisense office down there. Why? Because we've got 6401k participants in that town. We've got a manufacturer that's got 3,4000 employees. It's our largest client. We've got the hospital in town with 40 doctors. And bottom line, they wanted. We had problems there. I mean, at our largest client, they said, literally, you do a great job of getting our employees to retirement. But then they're preyed on by people that come in and sell them index annuities with 350 basis points of cost. The only way that we could like that. And, you know, so we've got an office down there. What was the attraction? I didn't move somebody from Minnesota down there. I went and asked for references from somebody that would do it on a fee basis and take a fiduciary stance, just like we take in the 401k. And I went and I dangled those 401k participants in front of me. [47:56] Chad: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I like that. [47:59] Mark: So every 401k advisor has that same asset that you could use to attract a private wealth advisor to join you. [48:07] Chad: I haven't thought about it that way until having Brad on here tonight. I think a lot of people all over the country could take that approach. [48:16] JD: The reason why, Chad, we've been talking [48:18] Chad: about this for weeks, for months, really, [48:20] JD: and we've had some debates on this [48:21] Chad: show about whether you would stick to being a true 401k pro or whether you would start to bleed into some of these other areas. And I know we've gone back and forth, but when I saw Brad and what he had done, and specifically from [48:33] JD: a visual, all of those logos, I [48:36] Chad: was like, okay, this guy is really all in on this, you know, and he's building a successful business. So it's just a theme I keep seeing. And I know a lot of people that have tuned in have heard this before, and I know it frustrates Mark that we talk about it all the time, but I think people. [48:52] JD: Let me ask you, Brad, you're a smart dude. You've been doing this a long time. [48:54] Chad: And then, Chad, what's your opinion? [49:00] JD: I won't say. [49:01] Chad: I won't ask you if someone can't succeed by doing this, because I know they could succeed without doing this. [49:07] JD: Anyone could get into a niche and succeed. [49:12] Chad: But is this the smartest way to succeed as an advisor who works in the 401k space is with all those little logos doing all kinds of different things. Wealth, health, et cetera. Is it the smartest way? [49:26] Mark: Well, you know, I know as a record keeper, our fees were getting compressed dramatically. And I can tell you, as a 401k advisor, our fees are getting dramatically compressed. I mean, we. And at the same time, we saw these employees out there in our plans that were being asked to make decisions that they had no training, experience or background in making. I mean, they had to select every year, you know, they had to make healthcare, you know, elections among four different health plans. And they didn't have a clue what a deductible one. [50:07] JD: Those two, you can save them up. [50:09] Mark: And then they had this 401k plan. [50:11] Speaker F: That's three other options. [50:16] JD: You can always save them up. You owe us three. [50:18] Mark: And so we needed to come up with a solution that would, number one, help our margins as a company, and number two, deal with a very major issue in corporate America today. And that is the overall financial health of the American worker, which even before COVID had been exposed as being very, very weak. I mean, prior to Covid, 72% of Americans didn't have an emergency fund. That was, prior to Covid, terrifying. I mean, so just think about that and you know how to do budgeting and they don't. They desperately need help. And I believe that if you can put a business plan together to help those people. Plus be profitable for your firm. But you've got to grab a bigger share of the employee benefits wallet, and you must get into private wealth. [51:24] Chad: And isn't that just good business, really? [51:28] JD: I mean, there's a reason why your [51:30] Chad: local gas station has a little Food Mart in it, and there's a reason why your local gas station has an auto repair shop in it. [51:39] JD: And there's a reason why the good ones threw a little car wash tech around the back of it. [51:44] Chad: You need to sell more things to your existing client base. That's just Entrepreneur 101 running a good fucking business. [51:52] Brad Ahrens: Example there, JD. [51:53] JD: What, you like that one? [51:54] Brad Ahrens: I really did. I didn't know where you were going with that. I really enjoyed that. [51:58] JD: Well, anyways, I just think we've talked about it ad nauseum on the show a lot. We'll dive a little bit more deeper later. But to me, I think. [52:05] Speaker F: Hold on. [52:06] JD: Yeah. [52:07] Speaker F: Step away from an advisor who chooses to be solely focused. [52:12] Chad: Oh, they can. [52:13] Speaker F: You can be solely focused on the 401k space or any other level in this financial. I can't say the P word, but the full financial picture for an individual, the key is you have to have resources and connections to the other services that this person needs. So you don't have to be like Brad and offer them all, but it needs to be a part of your practice. [52:41] JD: See, Nevin says. [52:43] Chad: Nevin puts it perfectly. Being the literary genius that he is, he says, jack of all trades, master of none. And of course, we all agree with that statement. But the question is, is how far are you diverging from the core? Because. [52:58] JD: Okay, let me poke you, J.D. [53:00] Speaker F: let me poke you, because for 12 years that I've been with you now. I've said, do we look at offering payroll services? Do we look at pushing into these other areas that as a tpa we can service this existing clientele? And the step back to Nevin's point has not been be a jack of all trades. We are a master of one one, and we are very fucking good at what we do. [53:26] Brad Ahrens: Whoa, whoa. [53:27] Speaker F: But what we do is we partner with advisors, we partner with other record keepers, we partner with other wellness solutions that are out there and we say, no, we're not delivering all that. We're going to focus in this one area, but we are going to have solutions in them all. [53:41] JD: Yeah, but I don't drive a Lambo. [53:44] Speaker F: I don't think you're ever going to drive a Lambo. [53:46] JD: No, but you also know, and we can't talk to the audience about it. [53:49] Chad: I do have plans to [53:55] JD: sell other things to my clients. So I do have some concepts, but [53:59] Chad: they're going to be outside of this space. [54:01] JD: But anyways, I get what you're saying and you said it at first. [54:04] Chad: You can succeed both ways. I was just asking Brad, and I'm trying to ask the audience to ask themselves what's the smartest way? And I think that the proper answer to that might be some type of convergence of these different services. And there's lots of details to it. Brad knows all so well. [54:23] JD: You know, how are you going to service it? [54:25] Chad: How are you going to fulfill it? How are you going to set it up? Are you going to partner? Are you going to build? I mean, there's lots of questions, but [54:30] JD: let's have a little fun. Let's shoot it on over to Robe guy and explain your game to Brad. Robe guy, I did not think about. He didn't do anything. He's been off for two weeks. He didn't fucking do anything. [54:47] Justin: One for Monday, Marks. [54:49] Speaker F: We've given him some lamer game options this week, but it came about that he's sitting here because we chose not to travel to Missouri. And I called him and said we're staying in town. Come stay with us for the next few nights. So Mark, his wife and kids are all in the house. Wife and kids are in the house. Mark's out here, I'm here and he's hanging out with me for the cash. He hasn't thought about it. [55:10] JD: We're chat bar, chat bar, Help Mark out, throw a few at him. [55:15] Brad Ahrens: I can pull this one out of the head. [55:18] JD: Explain the game to our guest. [55:20] Brad Ahrens: Well, first off, we're just gonna Go freestyle here today, okay? So bear with me, Brad. The name of the game is the Lame Game. Game. For lack of better terms, there's my. So the point. What do you. [55:41] JD: I can't drink it straight anymore. [55:42] Brad Ahrens: The point of the game, Brad, is that I'm gonna ask some questions, and it's just gonna be very simple, and you're gonna. Your answer is basically. It's. Basically. Is it lame, or are you game? Is that simple enough? [55:58] Mark: Yeah. Yeah. [55:59] Brad Ahrens: All right. [56:00] Mark: Yeah. [56:01] Brad Ahrens: So you know what? I'm just gonna go off the cuff here, like I said. And the first thing, again, from a social media perspective, I get that there are a lot of trends and challenges and things people do. Like right now on Instagram. Is it lame, or are you game with people posting their stupid, hey, guess what? The top five different bands I listen to or they're like, their top music selections from their Spotify this year. If you've seen it, you'll know what I'm talking about. And maybe you like it. [56:39] Speaker F: Yeah. No. God, please, no. [56:42] Brad Ahrens: Brad, I don't know if you partake in the Grandma Vinta. [56:46] Justin: Amanda says her dad has no idea how to use Spotify. [56:49] Brad Ahrens: Well, Amanda, can you answer for your dad maybe? Like, let's hear from you. [56:55] Mark: Yeah, let Amanda answer those questions. [56:59] Brad Ahrens: So how about this? It would be the same as, like, people just sending out a list of, like, their top five favorite things, and everyone does food. Yeah. Are you. Are you into that? Is that lame? Are you game? [57:11] Mark: I don't do that. The only social media that I'm on is LinkedIn. I don't have Facebook. I don't have Instagram. I know my kids do, but that's. That's where I'm at. [57:24] Speaker F: So what you're saying is Amanda's game. [57:27] Mark: Oh, Amanda has definite game. She does in a lot of ways. Yeah. [57:32] Brad Ahrens: Justin, you're a music lover. Yeah, I'm not posting that. [57:38] Justin: You learn a lot of interesting things about people, though. [57:43] Brad Ahrens: Like what? Nothing. [57:45] Speaker F: Oh, you can learn a lot. No, if I post, like, Enya, you would know a lot about it. [57:53] Brad Ahrens: If Justin posted that his number one played song was wap, then I would learn a lot about him. JD Curl. [58:00] Speaker F: I'm not gonna say it. [58:01] Chad: Just don't ask our guests what WAP is. [58:06] JD: I'm actually kind of a fan because I'm always on the hunt for new music, new things, and so if I see someone's Spotify list, it intrigues me. I'm in. I'm game. [58:18] Mark: Chad. [58:19] Speaker F: I'm very lame topic. Yep. [58:23] Brad Ahrens: All Right. You know, I'm gonna. I'm in the holiday spirit. I went through a little drive through Christmas in the park the other night. So my question is this, and I'll be honest, it's something that I really like. What was that? [58:36] Speaker F: Look at Josh's comment. [58:38] Brad Ahrens: Oh, that's a great one. Josh, you're hired. Eggnog lame or game? [58:46] Mark: I like good eggnog. You want to know who makes good eggnog? Yeah, Amanda. I mean, it's good eggnog. [58:55] Speaker F: A lot of love in this family. [58:57] Brad Ahrens: Wait, but Brad, hold on. Eggnog in my mind, like I out of the carton is just fine for me. Are you talking about with booze? [59:05] Mark: Yeah. [59:06] Brad Ahrens: Mark, look at her recipe the other way. What? [59:11] JD: She chatted her recipe. She just puts a. Oh my gosh, he's got eggnog. [59:18] Brad Ahrens: All right. [59:19] JD: JD oh, eggnog's so good and so locale. [59:23] Chad: I'm so in. [59:24] Brad Ahrens: Yeah, dad, I'm in. [59:27] Chad: I'm shocked. [59:28] Brad Ahrens: Like, eggnog seems to be a weird. [59:31] Speaker F: It's got booze in it. [59:32] Brad Ahrens: It's so good always. [59:33] Chad: Not always. It's so good always. [59:35] Brad Ahrens: Okay, okay, okay. My next one is all lowercase letters for a company name. [59:43] Chad: Thank you. [59:44] JD: What the fuck is that about? [59:45] Speaker F: Brad. Brad. [59:47] Brad Ahrens: You know, just, just a capital letter starts a word. [59:53] Mark: It is kind of a pain when you want to start a sentence with the word intellisense, I will admit. Are you asking me if it's got game or why, why we did it or. [1:00:06] Brad Ahrens: You answer that however you want. You're the esteemed guest here, Brad. [1:00:11] Mark: Well, I'll tell you why we did it. We. We knew we had to change our name because our old name, Alliance Benefit Group, it has a record keeping connotation and we were no longer record keepers and we, we wanted to come up with a cool name. I didn't want a name that, you know, just was ho hum. I wanted something that was a takeoff out of. And I didn't want to make up a word, so I wanted it to be a play on words. And obviously we wanted to play off the word intelligent. And I thought intelligent was. [1:00:42] JD: I just figured that out what the [1:00:44] Brad Ahrens: hell really [1:00:47] Mark: had to do with, you know, we knew that we were going to put together a company that was a legacy company, but we were going to act more like a startup and that it was going to be based on people smarts plus great technology. So why do we make it lowercase? Because there were tech companies out at the time that started their logo, their name in lowercase that's why we did it. [1:01:14] JD: Copycat. Trying to be cool, trying to be like the cool kids, trying to just. [1:01:19] Mark: No doubt about it, it was all part of branding. I mean, I spent the first. Oh gosh. It wasn't until I didn't learn the power of branding really until we went down this path because we all of a sudden said we're going to take a regional practice, original consulting practice, investment practice, and try to grow it into a national footprint. Which meant we had to really get serious about branding. And so we spent a lot of time, a lot of money, had a lot of professionals come in and help us. And the power of marketing is just unbelievable. I wish I would have taken this stance if I had a do over. That'd be one of the major do overs, is just the power of marketing. [1:02:02] JD: Brad, this would be my advice, this would be my advice to you. Given Amanda's profile shots, the cool hat [1:02:10] Chad: she wears, you should probably just check [1:02:12] JD: in with her when you're gonna do any marketing or branding stuff. [1:02:16] Mark: She's the head of our marketing department. [1:02:18] JD: She'll straighten you out. [1:02:19] Speaker F: There you go. Hit that point a little bit though, J.D. that's coming from a 30 plus year vet and clearly you saw that as a weakness of PDC when you took over your dad's firm. Like the branding, the marketing side of things that people often overlook with the work that they're doing is so important, so incredibly important. And very few advisors spend time on their brand. [1:02:46] Chad: People make, I'll call them consumers. Consumers make decisions based on things they see visually and how it makes them feel and what their kind of first gut impression is. And so you can catch them with colors and fonts and clean design, certain vibes and feelings and emotions. And the financial advisor community for the most part sucks at that. So we need to get a lot better. [1:03:19] Mark: Now there are some very, very notable marketers that pay a lot of attention to the financial services community, specifically the 401k community. And we know, we all know who they are. [1:03:33] JD: And do you think they're any good? Because I think they're all pretty shitty, to be quite honest with you. Like the FMG suites, the different people that are doing the stuff, they've got [1:03:43] Chad: the tech figured out, but they're far [1:03:45] JD: from artistic and creative. And I don't think they're pushing our [1:03:50] Chad: industry in the proper direction. [1:03:52] JD: So I'd like to see better stuff out of them. [1:03:54] Chad: But that's my opinion. [1:03:56] Mark: I think there's a couple creative ones. I mean people that we've used in the past. Today we have it on site, on staff and we'll continue on that. I would project. I mean we have basically a marketing department of two and a half today. And as we grow, that department will continue to grow because once you go down this path, you get addicted to it. And in the beginning you don't realize the power of it. But it is extremely powerful marketing. And if you want to create even a local or regional brand, it is just mission critical that you work on that brand and you spend time and money on that brand and find creative visionaries that are going to help you if you don't have that skill set yourself. We're fortunate we have it on staff today, but it will grow. I can see five years from now our marketing part department might be three times bigger than it is today. Sales guys are addicted to it today. Yeah, just the quality of the stuff that they put out. [1:05:03] Justin: Despite Mark's cheap attempt at making it sound lame. I think your logo looks great, lowercase and all [1:05:10] Speaker F: right. [1:05:10] Brad Ahrens: Not a cheap attempt by any means way. I felt I will say that intellisense sounds better than intellidollars. I'm just saying, like most of us want more. So kudos to whomever you paid to tell you that they earned their dollars to tell you sense sounded better. And you know what, you know what they say? [1:05:35] Chad: You know what they say? [1:05:36] Mark: Well, originally they say sense, like common sense, but somebody had already taken that part. So we thought about the sense in terms of, okay, that sounds like something small amounts of money instead of large amounts of money. But it was available. We played off of it. [1:05:51] Brad Ahrens: Good choice. [1:05:53] JD: I was so glad to hear you [1:05:54] Chad: say what you just said about the [1:05:56] JD: design and the marketing. [1:05:57] Chad: And I hope if you're listening in, you take notice and start to make some efforts because I do think that we got a long way to go as an industry to get better at it. And it's great to hear people like you who are at the helm of these financial institutions that are so excited by it and know how important it is. So I'm excited to see what they're the future looks like we're kind of [1:06:19] JD: at the quick, a very quick potpourri moment. Chad, did you. We go for random questions and so I've got a few lined up. Mark never preps. [1:06:33] Brad Ahrens: No, I'm good. I'm right here with you. [1:06:35] JD: Chad's got notes. I had a quick question for you. [1:06:37] Speaker F: No, I don't. [1:06:38] JD: Oh, I saw you when you were [1:06:41] Chad: being interviewed by John Sullivan. [1:06:43] JD: You were at the GRP Advisor Alliance Conference, I think it was down in San Diego. We had Chetney on this program several weeks ago. We had a blast with Chetney. Are you not kind of a competitor to them? [1:07:01] Chad: And what were you doing at their conference? [1:07:03] Mark: Well, actually, I'm a GRP member. [1:07:05] JD: Okay, so explain that to me. [1:07:07] Chad: That's what I was asking. [1:07:08] Mark: Well, you know, in the beginning, why are we a GRP member? They've got some really cool stuff that we didn't want to build on our own in the beginning. It started with the CITs that they were putting together, and then also Financial Wellness with Financial Finesse. And so we stayed GRP members because we could get that. We could get it cheaper than going at it on our own. Now, today, we are still members. We effectively have built our own solution for financial wellness, and that's what we're taking out to our clients today. [1:07:48] Chad: You are not using Financial Finesse anymore. [1:07:51] JD: We're not any longer because we had heard the founder on the show. What was her name? [1:07:56] Chad: Shit. [1:07:57] JD: She was on the show. [1:07:58] Speaker F: She said the prohibitive word 48 times. [1:08:02] JD: The founder of. Dang it. I'm drawing a blank. [1:08:06] Mark: Liz. [1:08:07] JD: It's not Janet Yellen. Yeah, Liz. [1:08:09] Brad Ahrens: David Greg just got my vote for [1:08:12] JD: chat bar champion with his Janet Yellen, [1:08:14] Chad: Hillary Clinton comments there. [1:08:17] Mark: Okay. [1:08:18] JD: Do you guys have a question? He answered my question. Do you have a question for the man? [1:08:22] Speaker F: I do, yeah. [1:08:24] Brad Ahrens: You. [1:08:24] Speaker F: Me? You. Me. No, I'm going. [1:08:27] Justin: I'll go. Hey, Brad, how many vests do you have? Do you have multiple vests like Brett? [1:08:32] JD: Good question. [1:08:32] Mark: Yeah, I have several. They only come out in the fall. The fall and the winter. I mean, summers are not best times. Summers are T shirt times. But I have more than one. [1:08:46] JD: Yes, Amanda, Are they all good vests or some? [1:08:50] Chad: Not so much. [1:08:51] JD: I don't know, Chad. [1:08:54] Chad: That was a great question, Justin. [1:08:55] Speaker F: Thanks, Shannon. I'm curious if the record keeping space's margin is getting narrow. [1:09:03] Brad Ahrens: Here we go. [1:09:04] Speaker F: You saw. You've seen and moved on from that space. Will the advisor community take over the record keeping role? Because right now we leverage record keepers for education, for in person interaction, for enrollment meetings. Our advisors are going to grab all that back because they want access to those participants for future financial planning. [1:09:27] Mark: Yes. Well, guys, just look at what Captrust1 Digital and Hub are doing. I mean, they're taking that all back. They want to control that participant. They want to. They want to be the ones doing. Putting together a financial program for that participant. That's what they want. Then you got to go and look at Fidelity Empower and Schwab and they're getting in our business. There's folks, I mean, they, they are getting in our business as advisors. All of a sudden we are, you know, if we don't do what it does, what it takes to compete, they're going to be compelling competitors. So. Not want that record keeper controlling my participant. [1:10:21] Speaker F: I want to Nevin. Sorry, J.D. [1:10:25] JD: no, he says that ain't new. But Nevin, it is kind of new in a different way. I understand that the empowers could potentially have played an advisor role in the past. And Chad, you and I both know [1:10:41] Chad: that there's record keepers out there that take on plans without advisors, even today. [1:10:46] JD: But what Brad's talking about is a different world. You're talking about full control, getting in there, all in. [1:10:53] Chad: This is exciting stuff, man. [1:10:56] Speaker F: That was the fear of Andre. Remember when we were talking about Andre's side? But to my point to Nevin is what is new is the margin shrinking for the record keeping space. The margins for record keepers used to be so good. They didn't need to be in the aum, they didn't need to be in the asset management space. They can make enough on being the RK for the 401k. Now they're trying to put their own investments out, their own advisory services, their own wealth planning services, because they're looking for areas to make money. [1:11:30] Chad: The record keeping margins have shrunk, but the opportunities for record keepers to make money on other things, that is the [1:11:41] JD: value of the data alone is a new frontier. And so they might not mind that [1:11:47] Chad: the actual fees for record keeping aren't so great because there's so many other opportunities. [1:11:52] JD: And I'm not just talking about the logos we were talking about earlier. [1:11:55] Chad: Let's just talk about the participant data [1:11:57] JD: which could be sold and anyways, this is cool. Let's wrap this. [1:12:02] Brad Ahrens: I didn't get a question. [1:12:04] JD: Sorry. [1:12:05] Mark: Go ahead. [1:12:07] Brad Ahrens: It's nice to go from a serious question to what, you know, what they say. Have you ever been told that? I'm just curious, if someone said you're the doppelganger for a celebrity, who would that celebrity be? [1:12:23] Speaker F: He's got two. I got one for him. [1:12:27] Mark: Well, I can tell you in college and realize this was back in the early 80s, late 70s, early 80s, we all grew up mustache. We didn't have beards, we had a mustache. And at the time, there were still a lot of cigarette ads out there. And there was a character called the Marlboro Man. And back Then everybody in college, they called me the Marlboro man, even though I didn't smoke. I didn't smoke a cigarette. So obviously you must have an idea of something. [1:13:05] JD: I feel like Mark. I feel like that was kind of a humble brag on Brad's part. The marble man is, like, just so handsome guy. [1:13:13] Chad: Like, wow, that was. Go ahead. [1:13:14] Brad Ahrens: I don't know nowadays with the cancel culture, right? Like, no, that ain't cool at all, man. You're killing people. [1:13:23] Mark: We're talking back. You know, there are. [1:13:28] Brad Ahrens: There are two doppelgangers that you have in my mind, actually, if these two individuals had a child, it might be you. That's what I'm saying. And that's that. So Chad picked one perfectly. And I was curious. Michael Rapaport. Have you ever been referenced like him? Yeah. [1:13:48] Chad: Come on. [1:13:49] Speaker F: Oh, my God, yes. [1:13:50] Brad Ahrens: Yes. Michael Rappaport for sure. [1:13:52] Justin: I did not see you going there. [1:13:53] Speaker F: I just pulled it up over here. [1:13:55] Mark: Let me see. [1:13:58] JD: Hey, Brandon, I'm forwarding you an email from Amanda, his daughter right now. [1:14:04] Justin: James Cromwell. And someone said it earlier, a mix of James Cromwell is what I'm thinking. With Sam Shepard. [1:14:11] Brad Ahrens: No, now I have to figure out his name. Oh, Trey Wingo from espn. That was my other one. [1:14:17] Speaker F: I don't know that one. [1:14:18] JD: Your daughter is hilarious, bro. She just sent me the most awesome pictures of you, of her being you. [1:14:25] Speaker F: Really? [1:14:25] Mark: I sounded really flattery that I've thrown at her over this past hour. [1:14:32] JD: I was gonna say, who's the dude? Who's the actor? That his daughter gets kidnapped and he goes to find her and kills everyone in his path? [1:14:46] Brad Ahrens: I have a special set of skills. [1:14:49] Speaker F: That was quick. Greg. Greg beat me to that one. So did Carl. [1:14:52] Brad Ahrens: What? [1:14:53] JD: Liam Neeson, because we are choosing who his doppelganger is. [1:14:58] Chad: Right? [1:14:58] Brad Ahrens: Right. [1:14:59] Speaker F: Dude, Brandon's got to pull Michael Rapaport because. [1:15:01] Brad Ahrens: Yeah, Brandon, you have. [1:15:03] Speaker F: It's 100. [1:15:04] Brad Ahrens: Very much so. The case. Yeah. [1:15:06] JD: Can we end the show before we get in after show mode? Because I feel like we're in after show. [1:15:11] Brad Ahrens: Oh, yeah. [1:15:12] Speaker F: But I took nine shots of shots. [1:15:14] Brad Ahrens: Chad's been there since minute 12, so we're good. [1:15:18] JD: Brandon, I sent you an email. You gotta. [1:15:20] Chad: You gotta check it and pull it if you got the text. [1:15:22] Brad Ahrens: No, he's saying Brad. Brandon, come on, dude. [1:15:26] Mark: No, I'm saying no to Rapaport. He literally looks like Rapaport. [1:15:31] Brad Ahrens: You're wrong. [1:15:31] Speaker F: As right now. [1:15:33] JD: What about Liam? [1:15:34] Chad: What about Liam Nelson? A little bit. [1:15:36] Brad Ahrens: Brad, it's not for you to decide. It's for Us to tell you that. [1:15:40] Mark: Oh, wait. [1:15:40] JD: Okay. Let's do Chapar Champion. We'll play a song. [1:15:45] Brad Ahrens: Come on. [1:15:45] Chad: Hey, let's play Chat Bar Champion. [1:15:49] Brad Ahrens: Oh. [1:15:50] JD: What is going on? [1:15:52] Chad: Chad, you can't steal the screen. [1:15:54] Speaker F: That's him. No, that's him. [1:15:57] Brad Ahrens: There it goes. [1:15:58] JD: Brandon, that's Amanda dressing up as her father. [1:16:05] Brad Ahrens: Why is she doing the Mini Me? [1:16:07] JD: He does that move at work. He does that move. He's like, let's open an office in Iowa. [1:16:12] Mark: I remember that. Yeah. [1:16:14] JD: Okay. Chat Bar Champion. [1:16:16] Mark: Yeah. [1:16:17] JD: Who? I guess anybody can win because we had no one last week. [1:16:21] Chad: Yes. Mark, [1:16:23] Brad Ahrens: are you ready for my answer? [1:16:25] Mark: Sure. [1:16:25] Brad Ahrens: Go, Amanda. [1:16:29] Chad: Solid. Shit, Chad. [1:16:34] Speaker F: I'm going with Greg S. Greg S. Had an early showing and a late showing week in between Greg. But early and late was good. [1:16:42] JD: Dang it. [1:16:44] Chad: Justin. [1:16:45] Justin: Greg as well. [1:16:46] Speaker F: Greg S. Greg G or Greg S. Oh, shit. [1:16:49] Justin: I think it's Greg G. Yeah. [1:16:53] Brad Ahrens: Huh. [1:16:54] Speaker F: There's a lot in there. They were both active tonight. [1:16:57] Justin: Which one had the. God, what the hell was that comment anyways? It's Greg. Greg's gonna win. [1:17:01] Chad: Yeah. [1:17:01] JD: Shit. I was gonna go. Well, I'm gonna wait. Let's see what our guest says. Brad, you can vote for your own daughter. We don't care. You hired her on your company, so nepotism is alive. [1:17:12] Mark: So I have to pick from who? I mean, the whole audience. [1:17:16] JD: Anybody. [1:17:17] Brad Ahrens: Anybody. [1:17:17] JD: Yeah. [1:17:18] Brad Ahrens: You can pick me if you want. [1:17:19] Mark: I'm gonna pick you. Thank you. [1:17:21] Speaker F: Wow. [1:17:22] Mark: Thank you. [1:17:23] Speaker F: Wow. You a homer, Brad. [1:17:27] Mark: You did the best. You got the most shit thrown at you, and yet you still persevered. [1:17:34] JD: That means, you know what, And I [1:17:35] Mark: just want to know what it takes to get, you know, an Intellisense logo brain on. On your rope there. [1:17:42] Brad Ahrens: I'll tell you right now, Brad. I'll tell you right now, absolutely nothing. [1:17:47] Speaker F: All you have to do, send him a label. [1:17:51] Brad Ahrens: Shipping and handling, I guess, is the only thing. Because you're gonna have to send me something that has your logo on it. And I will glue, staple, tape, whatever you need me to do, onto the road. I don't know how to sew. Okay. [1:18:04] Mark: So I'm just Amanda. You got that? We've got a bunch of stuff that we could say. [1:18:08] Brad Ahrens: Amanda, hook me up. Let me know. You get front and center wherever you want. [1:18:15] Chad: You know, we had Fred Reich on this show once. I was such a big fan. I was really into the guy. And he left the show being Mark's best friend. [1:18:28] JD: You know, he thought Mark was the coolest. And I started this show with my brother I'm supposed to be the star of the show. It's supposed to all be about me. And every time we get one of you big fancy guests on, you fall in love with fucking Mark Robe guy. And now this is all. It's all about Robe guy and I'm just over it. No, you know what? I'm not Mark. I appreciate that you're now the star. You are the Justin Timberlake of our nsync. [1:18:59] Speaker F: Okay. [1:19:00] Brad Ahrens: Incredibly false, by the way. [1:19:03] JD: I can break this. So I was going to vote Greg [1:19:09] Chad: G. [1:19:11] JD: I had forgotten about Amanda and she has done a phenomenal job. [1:19:17] Brad Ahrens: She gave an eggnog recipe, bro. [1:19:19] JD: Greg G has one before. [1:19:21] Chad: No. Yes. [1:19:22] Brad Ahrens: He has to have, right? [1:19:24] JD: Not that. Not that that would matter. Not that that would. Would matter. [1:19:27] Speaker F: Yeah, for sure. [1:19:29] Brad Ahrens: If not, just send him something. [1:19:30] Speaker F: Anyways. [1:19:31] Mark: You're not helping me, guys. She's gonna come after a raise tomorrow, you know, just because of this. [1:19:36] Brad Ahrens: Hey, give her her a raise. [1:19:37] Mark: You know, I just gave her a raise a month ago. [1:19:40] JD: My vote is for. Only because Greg G literally just chatted. My vote is for Amanda. Amanda is the chat box champion. Catch me outside. How about that? Outside, how about that? Amanda is the champ. We are going to stick around for a little after show if our guest sticks around. But thank you, everyone for tuning in. Amanda, you are the champ. That means we're sending retireholic swag. Get her in here to you, Mark. When is she going to get her swag? [1:20:13] Brad Ahrens: When? In the year 2023. [1:20:17] Speaker F: JD by the way, did you see Shannon's message? Shannon is crucial to the success of the retireholics. Yeah, she just wrote and said she won some swag at the Sal Tripote event in Hawaii and it has not been sent to her. [1:20:35] Chad: Ooh. [1:20:36] JD: Well, that's typical. That's only. That's less than a year ago, right? Wasn't her. [1:20:42] Speaker F: That's over a year. That was November. [1:20:44] JD: That's our normal shipping pattern. That's totally normal. [1:20:47] Mark: True. [1:20:49] Brad Ahrens: There's, like coming ground. There's next day, there's today, there's ground. And then there's [1:20:57] Mark: Pony Express. You guys are in the pony Express. [1:21:00] Chad: Yes, yes, yes. [1:21:01] Mark: All right. [1:21:01] Brad Ahrens: Thank you. Belt. [1:21:04] JD: Well, you're supposed to make the damn belt. [1:21:06] Mark: I know. [1:21:07] JD: Thank you, everyone for tuning in. We appreciate it. We might stick around for a little chat afterwards, but thank you. It's great to be back in the saddle with the boys after that Thanksgiving break. Thank you so much, Mr. CEO Fancy Pants Financial Services dude, for being with us. We really appreciate it. And Brandon, play a little music and [1:21:28] Chad: then we'll chat afterwards. Mark? [1:21:32] Mark: Chat. Can you guys stay around after? [1:21:34] Speaker F: Yeah. Okay. [1:21:36] Mark: Thanks. [1:21:36] Speaker F: Thanks. [1:21:37] JD: Thanks, everybody. [1:21:58] Speaker G: I feel a hot wind on my shoulder and the touch of a world that it's older I turn the switch and check the number I leave it on when in bed I slumber I hear the rhythms of the music I buy the product they never use it I hear the talking of the DJ can't understand just what does he say I'm on a Mexican radio I'm on a Mexican [1:22:30] Speaker F: radio.