Tod Ruble: Custodia, 3(38) Fiduciary Risks & Cybersecurity

[0:00] JD: I don't know if you know this, Todd, but before we get started, you're talking to a California surfer, born and raised, who bought my first piece of property in Texas about eight months ago. [0:13] Tod Ruble: You told me that last time we spoke. You said it's west of Austin. Where is it? Out by Lano? [0:19] JD: No, but Johnson City. On the way to Fredericksburg. [0:22] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [0:24] JD: Loving it. [0:26] Mark: Justin. Justin. Aren't you gonna be excited when JD Stops saying that and he tells everybody that he's. [0:32] JD: He said. He said he's from Texas. [0:36] Mark: We get it. We know. We know everybody. [0:38] JD: It was relevant. I didn't just slide it in there [0:41] Justin: with regard to, like. [0:42] Mark: That's worse than asking about the weather. [0:44] Justin: Just gonna say Lambos and bidets. It's still got a long time to go before it catches up. So true. [0:53] Mark: I'm okay with it. [0:55] JD: Yeah, I went. [0:56] Speaker E: In a world where retirement plans are broken, a team of four renegade ERISA nerds dared fix it. Justin McNeil, the wild card who plays by no one's rules. Chad Johansson, the technical wizard who can churn anything into a spreadsheet. J.D. carlson, the man with all the plans hiding under his beanie. And Mark Palamini, AKA Robe Guy, the heart and soul of the crew. Together, they are retireholics, changing the retirement plan industry one beer at a time. [1:33] JD: Yes, we are. Yes, we are. Yes, we are. We have a. No. Chad Johansson with us today. He's. What is he doing? Justin? Where is he? [1:44] Justin: We all tend to be on the golf course when we're missing these things. [1:48] Mark: Okay. [1:49] Justin: But he. That's been. [1:49] Mark: He was just talking. [1:50] Justin: That's been his thing all year, right? [1:53] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [1:54] Mark: He only misses when he goes to his kids. Sports Mark. [1:57] Justin: I was trying to make it look like he was actually out doing. You know, he's listening. I know he is. [2:03] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [2:03] JD: It does seem to center around golf in some format when Chad misses this. And the text I get from him is always very serious man or two, like, I really wish I could be there, but, you know, I have this thing, and it's. It's golfing. [2:20] Mark: The fact that he sends more shows than any of us. Just saying he's on a roll this year. [2:26] JD: That's fair. Let's get to it. You can hit the ball 300 yards, Chad. You can hit bombs. [2:33] Mark: I want to see your short. [2:34] JD: I know you pre cut. [2:35] Tod Ruble: Chad. [2:36] JD: Chad. Silent J. Let's get to it. My favorite bit of the show, your little new intro. Kick it off. [2:46] Justin: Today's guest is a recognized innovator in the retirement and Benefit industry. A sought after public speaker, a professional skydiver, a husband, a father, a multi entrepreneur, and JD's favorite part, a fellow Texan. Todd, we're switching things up this year. Have you seen the show before? [3:04] Tod Ruble: Have I seen the what? [3:06] Justin: The show before. Have you seen this? [3:08] Tod Ruble: Oh, yeah, perfect. [3:10] Justin: So you're familiar with what comes next, with the rapid fire questions that you have to answer within 1, 2, 3 words, right? [3:16] Tod Ruble: Yes. [3:17] Justin: Perfect. [3:18] JD: All right, I'd like you to go over that. [3:20] Justin: That is a great start. [3:24] Tod Ruble: Who's the referee on it? [3:25] Mark: I am. [3:26] Justin: I'm gonna ask you some questions. No, Mark. Or you're the referee elsewhere. I'm gonna ask you some questions. It helps the audience get to know you from your perspective rather than me, like it has been historically. So I got a few. [3:38] Tod Ruble: You know, I'm as ready as. I'm as ready as I can be for something. [3:42] Justin: All right. Our industry uses a lot of acronyms. Which one is your favorite? [3:48] Tod Ruble: My favorite acronym? Financial Wellness. [3:55] Mark: He has seen the show. He has seen the show. [3:58] JD: Justin, stop. Don't set him up for that because I. [4:03] Justin: That did not work out too well for me at all. You guys saw where I was. [4:06] Mark: That's a. I don't even know if [4:08] JD: Todd knows that he played you, but he played you, so. He did. [4:11] Justin: He really did. How many kids do you have? [4:16] Tod Ruble: 2. [4:17] Justin: Which one's your favorite? [4:20] Tod Ruble: I'll tell you what my mom told me when I was young. I love all of you. [4:23] Justin: One to three. One to three. I love it. [4:28] Tod Ruble: It's a tie. I'm like any other parent in this situation. It's a tie. [4:32] Justin: You know, I'm. I'm over two on this one. I've asked it twice now, and I'm going to get one. [4:37] Tod Ruble: I'm not trying to make it difficult. I'm not trying to make it difficult for you, Justin. [4:41] JD: You should ask. [4:42] Tod Ruble: Shows the relative strength of the questions, right? [4:45] Justin: It does, right? Who is or was your celebrity crushed? [4:51] Tod Ruble: Oh, I had a Fair Fawcett poster in my bedroom. [4:53] JD: Damn straight. [4:57] Tod Ruble: University of Texas. Maybe not as much of the football, but because Farrah Fawcett went to school. [5:02] JD: Once again, Todd, two or three words. Come on, it's not that complicated, Justin. [5:07] Mark: You gotta be a better referee. [5:08] JD: You had it. You had it with Farrah Fawcett. [5:10] Justin: Well, I was. I. I had it all. All prepped and ready to go. [5:13] Tod Ruble: Let's revert. [5:13] Justin: Rural Katie stole my thunder. [5:15] Tod Ruble: Say fair. [5:17] Justin: You're still saying words there, pal. That's double D. Who is. Who's paycheck's biggest competitor [5:27] Tod Ruble: letters adp. [5:30] Justin: They could drink. [5:31] Tod Ruble: All right, well, you're. [5:32] JD: You're screwing me up because I have to set him up on the designated drinker after this, but that's okay. [5:37] Justin: Oh, I didn't know that. Okay. [5:39] Mark: All right. [5:40] Justin: And last but not least, in the words of the great Danny Glover. Or should I say Roger Murtaugh, what was your first? I'm too old for this moment in life. [5:53] Mark: This first. [5:54] Tod Ruble: I'm too. For this. [5:56] Justin: I'm too old for this. You ever see Lethal Weapon? [6:03] Tod Ruble: We had someone call us Rich Corinth call us Corinthian Leather as they flipped their hand up our Custodia Financial. Corinthian leather from the old Lorenzo Llamas days of. Look, boss, you remember the. Remember Rich Corinthian leather? [6:25] JD: No, I don't, but I. I know who Lorenzo Lamas is. [6:29] Tod Ruble: This person. It's the longest acronym. [6:31] Mark: I don't know what we're talking about anymore. [6:33] Justin: Yeah, I don't know either, but it sounds like you're kind of proving the point anyways. Ladies and gentlemen, the founder and CEO I'll drink of Custodial Financial, Mr. Todd with 1D ruble. [6:45] JD: I like the 1D. I like the 1D. That's solid. Welcome to the show. Welcome to the show, Todd. Okay, a couple housekeeping items. Todd is temporarily not drinking alcohol, so I need to nominate someone from the audience to be a designated drinker. Now, Brandon, I. I know you were part of the email going back and forth. I thought maybe you were. Could be prepared to set someone up for us to view them drinking, but if not, no big deal. [7:19] Tod Ruble: I didn't. I didn't catch that part of the. [7:21] Justin: Boy, you. [7:22] JD: You really got inspired on Brandon these days. On the back and forth of it. Like, I'm just thinking he's catching it all, but he's. He's not. [7:30] Justin: I mean, perfect. [7:31] Mark: Perfect fit here would have been Todd with two Ds, right? Not relevant to me. So I just don't bother reading. [7:40] JD: So I need someone out there in the audience who's gonna drink for Todd with 1D. And I'll drink for Todd if I have to, says Jack. Are you for real, Jack? Let's get Tristan Carlson on the ball. Oh, is Tristan Carlson here in the. Is my son here? [7:59] Justin: Yeah, he is. [8:00] JD: Okay, that's a perfect. That's a. Can you just yell for him, Todd? Feel free to speak freely tonight. Every time you say an initialism or an acronym, my son will have to drink from his penalty. Drink at home. He's 12 years old and he's in middle school, so I hope. No, he's 22. He's going to get shit canned. Okay, Kristen it is. Hackler agrees. Next housekeeping item. Real quick. Chat bar champion, Rogue guy, Silent J. Brandon, help me out in bringing this new style to fruition. Like, watch the leaderboard throughout. Oh, there he is. Great. Watch the leaderboard throughout. Let us know who's doing well, who's leading, you know, chime in from time to time. I've been blowing it in terms of like, kind of heading up this new chat bar champion. Yeah, this. [8:58] Tod Ruble: Your. [8:58] JD: Your chapter champion sucks. Let's give it another shot, see if we can make it work to vote for someone. You do. What the do you do? Cbc, I'll drink and their name. Is that it? [9:12] Mark: Yep. [9:13] Tod Ruble: Okay. [9:15] JD: With all that behind. [9:16] Mark: Yeah, Chad, you can win, but you actually have to be say something funny. Not smart. [9:22] Justin: No, he's on though. He's driving right now. He should not be texting. [9:26] Mark: Just said, can I win with all [9:28] JD: that behind us, bc. Oh, I'll drink for that, too. You know, I like myself some coastlines. And when you're broke and hungry, you get in a bread line. If you're gusto, you like buying some guideline. But when you're a 401k pro in the chat bar, you know what you want. You want some headlines. [9:58] Mark: Oh, I like that. [10:00] Justin: That was good. [10:11] Tod Ruble: Damn. [10:12] JD: We're gonna start with. I'm actually pivoting. Brandon's got an article straight from Prime Capital's website that I sent him. But I would encourage everyone out there to actually go to the national association of Planet Advisors. John Sullivan Sully, friend of the show, wrote a piece called Exclusive Colangelo on Prime Capital's Carlyle deal. So the news here, everybody, is $600 million in hybrid capital are going to Scott Colangelo and his firm, Prime Capital Financial. So this is a big investment. Let's talk a bit about it. [10:58] Mark: What's hybrid? What's hybrid capital? [11:00] JD: Great, great question. [11:02] Mark: I'm only asking because Will Hackler and Jim Sampson text me and ask me to ask that question. [11:07] JD: Okay, I'm gonna cover that the track, give some of the stats. First, current valuation of the company, 1.8 billion with a. With the letter that it starts, I can say with a B. Yeah, you can say B. This is up from approximately 600 million in 2023. So in three short years, they've tripled their valuation, which is pretty impressive if you pay attention to that kind of Stuff. [11:38] Justin: When did Jani move over? [11:41] JD: Recently? [11:41] Justin: Oh no, no, not too correlation there. [11:45] JD: She's 100, part of that as well as Justin. Plenty of acquisitions. How did they get that growth? Through a ton of acquisitions. [11:54] Justin: Which is what I'm getting at is the money just seems to follow Janya. [11:57] JD: Yeah, well that's fair. That's fair. [11:59] Justin: She's good. [12:00] JD: Obviously assets under management up huge. How did they go about doing this? They did this through acquisitions, but they've had some natural growth. So to, to Mark's question, what is this hybrid deal? Well, I saw the route for a second and I started reading some of the articles. When you're an owner of a company like Prime Capital, and I don't just mean Scott because Jan is an owner, all these other advisors, not all of them, but a lot of them, come on, are owners. And especially as you start to get a little bit older, you'd like to cash in on some of that ownership. So that is from Scott's own words, that is part of what's happening with this 600 million is some of the owners are getting some liquidity for their investment. So this could be 5 million bucks in someone's wallet, 15 million in someone else's. Who knows? Maybe Scott's buying a new yacht for 50 million like we have. We have no idea. But some of it is that. And then I think the rest of it is now they've got a new, what do you call it, treasure chest war trove to go out there and purchase and grow and acquire other advisor firms. So Todd, what's your experience with private equity and all these firms coming in and, and creating liquidity and getting people money? I mean, do you play in these worlds? Do you understand what's going on there? Or are you like me and it's kind of new to you? [13:29] Tod Ruble: Yeah, I have a pretty decent handle on it. I think that there. It could be a couple things. It's probably deferred, it's probably secondary market comp, which means existing shares where people can cash out like you said, with the balance of it going for growth in their roll up acquisition strategy that they're incorporating around the country. So it allows the current ownership to monetize up their positions in the, in the, in the platform. [13:56] JD: Because that's no fun. That's no fun to be an owner in a 1.8 billion dollar company and you don't have a couple Lambos in the driveway. Like why you're not even living your life, you know, Gotta look liquidated, cash in, right? People Mark, I was looking for a comment. [14:13] Justin: Just another Lambo comment I'm gonna ignore. [14:15] JD: Just gonna move on. Good for Scott. We'll keep our eyes on and all the owners at Prime Capital and we'll keep their eye on, on their growth in this whole deal. I just want to bring to the attention because here we go again with all these investment firms and this private equity just throwing money around. So interesting times. The next headline I'd like to pay attention to is Meso Rose in the news again. We talked about them a few weeks ago or months ago when they bought Todd Gating's Leaf House as a. I consider Leaf House to be one of those mid range getting large but definitely an independent 338 fiduciary. Now they are purchasing the Flex Path 338 services. So not, not the Flex Path Collective Investment Trust or any of that stuff that Great Gray and Rob Barnett, past guests on the show are involved in but specifically the 338 Solutions. Todd, I'm going to kick this to you 338 Outsourcing that a lot of advisors do this on behalf of their plan sponsor clients. Do you want to live in a world where it's done by big massive firms like Mesereau and Morningstar AKA Drink. Do you see value in some of these smaller boutique firms or are we destined for it just to be a bunch of big players in this space? [15:43] Tod Ruble: Well I, I think plan sponsors mistakenly think that just because they brought brought on a 338 that they've offl offload. I'm not saying this across the board that they've offloaded all of the risk. They're obviously still responsible as the plan sponsor. But having a those deep pockets behind you as a CO338 who's overseeing the performance of the plan probably provides some level of. Of comfort. I, it's. It can't be, it can't be a bad thing because you. The main goal is to relieve the burden of that exposure to the plan sponsor from the, from your advisor standpoint. Is that correct? [16:22] JD: Yeah, for sure. Or advisor whoever's. You know that fiduciary. In that case I just mean. So you said deep pockets. Would that. Would I be putting words in your mouth to say you'd rather have the deep pockets of a Mesereau and a Morningstar versus a small firm? [16:39] Tod Ruble: Yeah. Yeah, I think you're exactly right. [16:42] JD: That's fair. I will, I will. I want to get this conversation started in another angle. If you've been reading Fred reaches blog posts. And I don't know if you know this about Fred over the last decade. He likes to take a subject and then really like hammer that subject in multiple blog posts. So he was doing that with the fiduciary rule over the last five to six years. Obviously that thing has been killed and is dead. And so now he's, he's on like I want to say article 17 or 18 of his analysis of the proposed Department of Labor regulations on, on how fiduciaries should pick designated investments. So the selection of investments and the six areas. And so if you haven't checked out, go to fredreach.com I think I drank for that and check it out. But here, if you read those articles, this has been my takeaway and this is where I want to get everyone's thoughts, chat bar included. All the language in this new Department of Labor propose regulations. They give a lot of examples of like a plan sponsor or a fiduciary being in a certain position as it relates to picking investments. And it's kind of scaring the shit out of me in terms of the detail they're giving and what they expect of a fiduciary. Like they really think these fiduciaries should know the intricacies of investments, underlying investments inside of managed accounts, inside of target date funds. And I'm the first one to tell you that most of these plan sponsors and their committees and the advisors that guide them, no offense to your general advisors, they don't know this shit very well at all. And so I think we might be looking at a boom for 338 outsourced fiduciary services if this regulation continues to go through. I feel like Mark338 fiduciary could be something that every plan sponsor should want to do simply to create some type of relief for themselves. Is that a crazy thought? [18:52] Mark: I wouldn't say it's a crazy thought, right, that plan sponsors might see the value in it. But where do the advisors sit in terms of their value and how they want to be involved in that? So, I mean, I don't know. I think that I see your point there. I think any plan sponsor wants to relieve themselves of anything where they fall asleep at night, have to worry about anything thing. But at the end of the day, you can't rid yourself of all liability just because you're bringing in a 338. [19:28] JD: As Todd mentioned earlier, you're still going to be responsible to monitor that 338 fiduciary. [19:33] Justin: But Justin, they Don't know how to, though. [19:35] JD: Yeah, right. How many advisors do you see taking on the 338 role as opposed to outsourcing them to some type of specialized firm? [19:45] Justin: Oh, okay. I was going to say 338 is definitely on a rise. You know, it doesn't have the negative connotation to it like it did when it first came out because advisors were like, oh, that's what I do. You know, it's my job to look at that stuff. But to that question, I still, I'm seeing still more, you know, not taking it on themselves. I would say the specialists definitely take it on themselves. Right. But a lot of the greenies that we work with or whatnot, they. They utilize the mezros of the world, those services, you know, straight through the record keeper. [20:14] JD: Todd, any thoughts on whether you feel like a financial advisor is, you know, hurting their role or their value by outsourcing that type of 338, or are you cool with that? [20:26] Justin: And feel free to use an acronym in that response. Tristan's thirsty. [20:31] Tod Ruble: It's just another example of bundling or unbundling that particular service. But I think it's going to go along with the advisors now because all it is is the responsibility to monitor assessment and take action, which you probably should be doing as their advisor anyway in plan design and investment lineup. And this is just another one of those decisions. I could see it both ways. I mean, plan sponsor wants somebody else on the hook that's got deep pockets and you want to provide an additional service, kind of like Fidelity did relative to Financial Engines when they said, okay, we're gonna, we're not just gonna provide you with the automated investment services. We're gonna, we're gonna step up behind you as a co fiduciary so that you know that we're minding the store. So I think it depends on how you want to market yourself as an advisor. [21:29] JD: What's the going rate, Justin? Mark, for 338 fiduciary services in our kind of micro market? [21:36] Justin: Five bibs through the record here. But yeah, if you're going personal or straight through the advisor. [21:41] Tod Ruble: It's an incremental five bips, right, Mark? Yeah. [21:45] JD: No, no, it's five basis points. [21:47] Mark: It's five straight. [21:48] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [21:48] JD: Drive straight. [21:49] Tod Ruble: I'm saying over and above the. The whatever you're charging. [21:53] Mark: Yes. Oh, yeah, yeah. It's a, it's added to the cost, right? [21:56] Tod Ruble: Yeah, that's what I asked by. It's an incremental increase in the, in the. [22:02] JD: On Top. Yeah, because. So let's imagine I'm advisor Todd and I mean we'll say it's a million dollar plan. I'm charging 50 basis points and according to the boys here, for 5 extra I can get a record keeper or someone to do the 338. I mean I haven't given this a lot of thought, so I apologize if anyone's going to beat me up in the chat bar, but I'm gonna outsource that. Why am I going to take on the responsibility to be a 338 if I can outsource it for 5 bits from my going to allow me to focus on other. [22:36] Mark: Is that, is that a penalty him? Have we decided that bips. [22:41] Justin: No, it's not because it's not multiple words. Oh, basis points. [22:45] JD: And maybe, maybe I can help my plan sponsor monitor the 338 investment fiduciary a little bit since they're going to be pretty novice at that. I, I just feel like this is going to be less done by individual financial advisors and more done by these firms, whether they're going to be boutique or whether they're going to be these big firms like Mezro. But do you think that. [23:12] Mark: Okay, so now let me ask you this though. Do you think that could create conflicts if things begin to consolidate into a more 338 driven approach where now it's not about right. Obviously they have to be monitored. There's got to be scoring. But certain 338s favoring certain proprietary funds or what have you where they're generating more revenue and it's just going to create more potential for, for, you know, the boogeymans of the world to come out of the woodworks and start looking into their methodologies and more conflicts there. [23:49] JD: Ask, ask Nate Moody about Great Gray, you know, retirement plan Advisory Group, collective investment trusts out there, the private equity and the investment firms behind all those companies, let alone the investment firms themselves. So is, is there a potential for conflict of interest and some secret phone calls or emails? For sure. I'm going to take back a little bit of what I said earlier in that I, I do think for five basis points, that's very cheap. And I think we might see a lot of really like big company simple solutions where they're not paying attention to nuance and, and like customization for clients. So maybe that's a great place for advisors to build that car wash alongside their gas station, if you will, to have a, a better 338 fiduciary. That's more customized to those clients. [24:46] Tod Ruble: Right. [24:47] JD: Anyways, I just think outsourcing, fiduciary responsibility and we're talking about as it relates to investments will become a bigger and bigger thing. [24:54] Mark: Can I, can I quickly not segue off of that topic but segue off of that article? And I. It was funny. I was reading it. Something really pissed me off so I wanted to get on a soapbox real quick. And I never do this, I never interrupt the show to do this. [25:10] JD: Go for it. [25:11] Mark: I'm really tired, and I mean extremely tired of every article that we write where something like this is announced, some sort of press release where there's an acquisition or a merger or whatever it is. And this quote from the CEO, I'll drink for that. Or the big players involved. And I'm going to read it because I hope everyone else agrees with me. If you don't, then whatever. The commitment to helping advisors and plan sponsors achieve better participant outcomes. Can we stop saying that? Can we? Everything is. We're just going to use this buzzword of participant outcomes. Shut up, dude. This is a transaction where you're going to make more money and we know that. Don't talk about participant outcomes. That's like saying financial wellness five years ago. [25:59] JD: I'm tired of it. [26:00] Mark: Please stop saying it. Go into chat. Three letter word. Find a new synonym for it for all I care. Call it roast beef. I don't give a crap. Say something else. You are paid millions of dollars. Your, your, your, your vocabulary has to be more expansive. Stop saying the same thing everyone else does. [26:21] JD: I feel like when you. There's an acquisition already about your blood [26:24] Justin: pressure right now, bud. [26:25] JD: When there's an acquisition within our industry to back up Robey. Why is it always like this is going to make us better? We're going to help people. We're going to do more good in the world instead of just like letting us know like yeah, some big baller stroked a check, bought a book of business from someone else to grow them. Those people got paid out. That's rhetorical question. [26:48] Justin: They're not going to say that. Come on. They got to say what they think is going to make everyone feel good. Which clearly has the adverse effect on Mark. [26:55] Mark: It's all participant outcomes. Yeah, shut up. Shut up, dude. [27:01] JD: This might really help this acquisition could really help participant outcomes. Todd, before I move on, can you tell me like your 3 or 4 favorite initialism or acronyms in the, in the industry, like which ones just roll off the tongue for you? D.C. yeah, that's a good one D, DB I think that's for free right there. [27:26] Tod Ruble: RFI. RFP. [27:30] JD: Nice. [27:31] Mark: Also, that's not a penalty. That's just a beer. Tristan, what are we doing here? [27:36] Justin: I think he's going to get it. [27:37] JD: Go leger count. Let's. Brandon, let's. Let's spin the wheel of ice, and then we're gonna. We're gonna play a quick game, okay? [27:45] Mark: Hold on. Wait. [27:47] Justin: Don't worry. All of us. [27:49] Tod Ruble: Chad, see if he has his. [27:51] JD: I'll drink for Chad. [27:53] Justin: Okay. [27:55] Mark: Penalty for whoever doesn't show up on the next show. That's what I'm. [27:58] Tod Ruble: That's what I'm. [28:03] Mark: That's just me. [28:03] Justin: Of course. Yeah. There's J.D. there we go. [28:08] JD: All right. [28:08] Mark: Hold on. [28:09] Speaker E: J.D. [28:09] Mark: are you sure you want me to do it? [28:10] Tod Ruble: No, no. [28:11] Mark: It hasn't been me for a long time. [28:13] JD: You can't do it because I gotta do it because I'm about to set you up. Sorry. [28:16] Mark: Okay. [28:17] JD: This company. Oh, I'll do it. I know when you get a little later in life. [28:24] Tod Ruble: Not. [28:24] JD: I'm not saying you're an old, old guy, but you're getting close there. It's important to really maximize your investments. You want to make money on the money you have. And I don't need to be telling you that. I'm sure you know that. But what I have for you today is a cheat code. I have a way for you to make millions in a very short period of time. You just pay close attention to what you're about to hear. Everybody, it's time to introduce the investment guru you've all came here for. It's Drunk Stock Tips with Robo. Yeah, Todd. That's what I look like, too. When I think about this, I'm like, my God. What the. This guy's about to blow my mind. I'm not going to give you the ticker yet, but this company traded at 27.66 with a market capitalization of 2.88 billion. [29:31] Mark: Was that market capital? Was that. Was that hybrid cap? [29:34] JD: No, straight up hybrid. With a price earnings ratio of just over 15, this company has a. Did almost four and a half billion dollars in sales in 2025. Slightly down from 2024. I think it's down like 13%. And they have approximately 5,500 employees across the globe. The ticker. The ticker is three letters. It's probably one of the better tickers in all of the stock market. The ticker is hog, H, O, G. I'm talking about none other than Harvey Davidson. [30:21] Mark: What a genius. Ticker. [30:24] JD: Yeah, It's a buy or a sell. Roby, what do we do? And Todd, as soon as he tells you, you get all the money you have anywhere, and you put it on this horse. [30:37] Mark: Okay, so first off, let me just have a disclaimer here for all the information that I'm about to give. My legal team tells me that I should tell everybody that this is not actually investment advice and that I am not held liable for the things. Not true. [30:53] JD: You make your own decisions. [30:55] Mark: But here's what I'm adding to my legal team's comment is that this will help participant outcomes if you listen. So, yeah, Harley, Harley, Harley, Harley. They make motorcycles. Okay, now let me tell you a little something about motorcycles. [31:12] JD: Jackets. [31:14] Mark: They've got two wheels. That's all I know about them. That's all. That's all I got. So Harley's to me, are like the Raiders that I beloved, my football team that I enjoy. People ask me, wow, that team really sucks. Why do you like them? And I tell them, it's a lifestyle decision. [31:32] Justin: It's not a smart decision. [31:35] Mark: Okay, so the same would go for a motorcycle. Wow, those are pretty dangerous. Wow, those are, you know, pretty lethal if something happens. But it's a lifestyle, man could just. Just everybody close your eyes. Close your eyes. Pretend that you're on the open road. Wind in your hair if you're jd, Wind in your face if you're Justin. And you're just. Your eyes are open at this point, but you're on the road. It's just you the cement yourself, your thoughts. Rumbling metal between your legs. There's nothing better. There's absolutely nothing better than that in my mind. What is a car at that point? A car is just jail cell, right? You need to be free. You need to feel the wind at your hair and not just with the windows down. [32:23] JD: Okay? [32:24] Mark: So, yeah, you're gonna buy this stock. You're gonna buy a lot of it, and you're gonna really enjoy it. When you go to the gas tank or the gas station and you gotta fill that thing up, and it's 14 bucks. Even better. [32:37] Justin: I don't know how much it costs [32:37] Mark: to fill gas tank on a motorcycle anyways. It's a buy. It's a lifestyle decision. Harley Davidson's here for the long haul. It's like the Disneyland for. For gangsters. [32:50] JD: Crack cocaine for gangsters. Can. Can somebody get put in a chat? Bar champion. Vote for Nate Moody and his comment about rogue guy's sister. Because I don't have access to keyboard. [33:01] Justin: Oh, I missed that. What'd he say? [33:03] JD: He said, your sister loved my rumbling metal hockey. Okay, Rogue guy said it here first, everyone. Harley Davidson, watch this stock. Pop the off tomorrow because that's what's gonna happen. People are listening. [33:20] Mark: Booking. I'm booking a flight to Maine where nobody goes because that place sucks. And I'm gonna go kick Nate Moody square in the dick. [33:31] JD: All right, let's move on to a topic that we probably should have talked about on this show before, and we didn't. The. The True Stage debacle. So I apologize to our retirement plan audience. I don't know why this didn't make the agenda in the last few shows. True Stage record Keeping services. Formally, this. I'm sure this is an acronym. Cuna. [34:00] Tod Ruble: Una Mutual. [34:01] JD: Yeah, and we have a. We have a. [34:03] Mark: He repeated it. Got a drink. [34:05] JD: We have a small amount of. Of clients with these guys. Not a lot by any means. But I. That's how I found out about this. Just through an internal email where someone on my staff was trying to figure out what was going on and they got cyber hacked. And literally all the participants, plan sponsors, all their clients, they have other sources of business, not just retirement plans, but we're locked out of their accounts, so everyone's freaking out. And you know what I said to my staff and I wanted them to reiterate this to our small handful of clients. I said, don't worry. This shall all pass very soon. They will sort this out. They will figure out the mistake, they will rectify it, and everything will be right as of today. Several weeks later, I go to their site and it's still. The update is fucking nothing. And people do not have access to their accounts. Many of them cannot do transactions. You can apparently call in via phone and maybe get your account balance, but this continues to be a problem at Trustage. And I don't want to, like, make any accusations, but I'm fearful that maybe it's worse than we've all imagined because I just think they would have sorted something out by now. [35:24] Justin: Are you saying the article lied? Because it did say that participants can now gain access to their assets and take distributions. But you're not seeing that on our side. [35:32] Mark: And request loans. [35:33] JD: If I go to the site right now at True Street. Oh, the actual site, it says current status, status Investigating. Last updated August 20th. Customers may experience difficulty accessing account information, completing transactions, or submitting requests online. And yes. [35:53] Mark: Hey, we've never done this on the. On the show. Should we call their customer service live on air? I would Love to do that. See if we can get through. [36:00] JD: I would love to do that someday. Todd, I'll just hit you with generalities here. You don't need to throw true stage under the bus if you don't want to. Just cyber security in general and these hacks. Did you lose sleep over this stuff at night? Do you worry that some big things gonna happen in the coming months? Like, we live in a different world now with AI and, and Fable and anthropic and who knows what like that, [36:26] Tod Ruble: Mark, I think the biggest concern about it is who did it over how big the reward can be for or the loss can be for the insurance that's behind it, you know, the cyber coverage. So when you. I don't know how you find bottom with how large that loss could actually be from a cyber, from a major cyber attack. Yet the insurers write it like it's, like it's life insurance, you know, or property and casualty coverage. It's uncertain what your exposure could be. [37:00] JD: A hundred percent. And let me be clear, I don't want to, like, say anything that's too off. I'm not. I don't believe that, like, money has been stolen or lost. I believe they've just been like. [37:12] Justin: It did say that in the article. [37:13] JD: Other systems, however, you've got a whole bunch of plan sponsors in the foreign case that are. That cannot get money into their plans right now. We were counseling some of ours to put them in savings accounts kind of as a holding pattern. And so there's definitely going to be some loss earnings. There's going to be some penalties, there's. There's going to be a monetary bogey here for them that insurance will need to cover. So your point is still very valid. But, but that's another great point. What, wait till we get the cyber attack where the money disappeared or something like that's going to be next level. [37:49] Justin: So it is interesting to see how many are not interesting. I'm curious to see how, you know, what the effects of, you know, loss of business is going to be. How many plan sponsors are going to move on? We got one doing it right now. [38:00] JD: Well, I've already heard that people are looking to mine those 5000 500s and find these clients so they can make calls to them. So we know that's what our industry is doing, right? Tristan? Yeah, he was telling me all. He was telling me all about. Tristan isn't just a designated drinker. He's also our internal sales consultant. And he was telling me that guys were looking for those lists to go knocking on those doors. So, yeah, I don't know, why are we telling. Why are we talking about this? Why are we bringing it up? I guess for two main learning points here. One is this kind of can happen and so when it does, we need to highlight it just so we all be aware of it. This makes me feel, I mean, with True Stage, a big vendor, this makes me feel like I would be far more comfortable if my clients were with some very big blue chip type vendors. I'm not saying that they can't get cyber hacked, but I sure would feel a lot more comfortable right now if, if instead of my plan being at True Stage, it was at Voya or Empower, I'm thinking they're gonna make right on all this, but maybe that's just conjecture on my part. And then lastly, although you wouldn't, you wouldn't solve this problem, I just, I was gonna say let's try and turn this into a positive. Like good advisors should be, should be well versed on this and great at like taking steps with their clients to protect them and make sure they got the right policies in place. But no, that's still a fair takeaway because these hacks can come from all different angles. And so I think it would be a great advisors to help their clients prepare. [39:33] Mark: What is the, the timeline for. Because again, they said it happened July 11th. Right. When did the first notification go out? Like, what, how long does it take for them to go from finding out what happened to then disclosing what happened? Is there like a. [39:51] Justin: They found it on July 11, but they just. And then July 15, I think is when they announced it to the public, but they don't know how long it had been incurring before they found it. [40:00] JD: Okay, here's my problem with that, Mark. If I could give advice through Stage, we found out, I found out through an email internally a couple weeks ago. Probably lines up with Justin's dates there. But here's been my problem along the way. And this kind of goes to your corporate language you're bitching about earlier. I've seen a lot of corporate disclosures from them, a lot of legalese speak and very little details. And so I feel like as a partner of theirs that has clients with them, I'd like a little more transparency from them on what's going on. Instead, I felt like they were just trying to kind of hold us at bay for a long time, and that was a very uncomfortable feeling. [40:43] Mark: So, yeah, wouldn't you think, again, you're, you Run it. You run a business. Wouldn't you think just being far more transparent with your clients is better than keeping them in the dark? [40:54] Justin: Because you. [40:54] Mark: Although it could be bad, they might actually have a little empathy afterwards and. And be like, hey, you came out. [41:00] Speaker E: You. [41:01] Mark: You were accountable, you let us know. [41:03] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [41:04] JD: Instead, I don't think you could do [41:05] Justin: that from a PR standpoint and be suicide. [41:08] Mark: Oh, yeah, Justin, is that right? [41:10] JD: And Justin, I'm sure their attorneys probably tell them they can't. Like, don't. Don't say this. Don't say that especially. [41:17] Mark: But also, damage control is another. You can. You can public relations this on the back end, right? Yeah. [41:23] Justin: But Nick Banting brought up a good point. He said, you know, if they don't know the extent of the hack, they would. Or if they knew the extent of the hack, they would have said it already. [41:30] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [41:31] JD: So they're still investigating it. Well, Nick, when it's three, four weeks later and you're still investigating, I'm getting scared. Like. Like, I want some detail. [41:43] Mark: They said they hired an outside cyber security firm, but at this point, what point do you go higher than that? [41:50] JD: Yeah. Or what time do you give up? I mean, the whole thing can be a ship on fire at this point. [41:55] Tod Ruble: What? [41:55] JD: Nate Moody was kidding about Great Gray buying them, Right. He just made that. [42:02] Tod Ruble: Good. [42:05] JD: Okay, Todd, I'm gonna slide on over to your website here at Custodia Financial. And as I do so, we are going to start this conversation on participant loans in retirement plans being defaulted. And on your site it says 40%. That's the percentage of 401k plan participants holding a loan over a five year period. That's pretty shocking. 40% is a percentage of foreign K participants that hold that loan over a five year period. 86% is the percent of participants with an outstanding loan balance who default when they leave their job. That makes sense to me. I think most people do that when they've got an outstanding loan, they leave their job, they default it. And what is this $300,000 retirement savings over a career. Lost retirement savings over career for a typical defaulting borrower. [43:06] Speaker E: Yes. [43:06] Mark: Robi, I just have a question, and I. And Todd, I don't want to put you on the spot here, but maybe you can work with your team. That one statistic of 40% from 2015. Do we think we can maybe get a little update there? [43:21] Tod Ruble: Yeah, and let me. One thing that's been pretty consistent is that borrowing is always hovering around 20%. That what I mean by that is 20% of your universe of participants and your outstanding. The 40% number means a unique borrower is 40% of your plan. Participants over a five year period will borrow against their 4:1 plan. Okay so that's even 20 extent which people are utilization are utilizing loans to [43:51] JD: even, even I would say 20% which would probably line up at my company we might even be higher than that. And we're in the business. You know people like to access their four 1K when they can if those loan provisions available. But Todd set the stage for us. Like before I met you and understood this, I didn't see loan defaults as a, as a problem. I just saw them as something that kind of happens. But your entire mission here is to solve this problem. So help set the stage for everyone listening in. [44:21] Tod Ruble: Yeah, it's like why does financial wellness ignore loan defaults if you've got, you're doing everything you can to maximize the return, you know, auto re enrollment, you know, bringing in different investment lineup. But you let anybody who borrowed with the intention of paying back their loan default on their loan when they involuntarily lose their job. This what's concerning is what they do after that. If they, if there was $150,000 account, they borrowed 10 grand, which is pretty close to the statistics, they cash out because they don't have any money to repay to repay the loan. And when they cash out they're taxed and penalized and all of a sudden a $10,000 loan on 102/3 of the participants are cashing the entire account out. So they're cashing out their $150,000 account. Their average age is 40. That's going to accumulate over the and compound over three decades a $10,000 loan turns into a $400,000 hole in your account at the end of the day and your retirement account. [45:28] JD: We all understand why they're doing that, right? Like they took that loan, let's say two years ago or whatever it was and they, they've spent that money, right? They needed it for something, whatever it was they, and so they most likely spent it. They didn't take the loan on it and go put it underneath their mattress. And so now here comes this unforeseen circumstance. They're leaving their job for whatever reason, they got a new job, they got fired, who knows what. And to your point, they don't have that money just sitting on hand. So, so not to make this a full advertisement for you, but let's do it for a moment. How are you then solving this so that you're, you're doing some type of insurance play or something, you're going to cover them, they're going to buy some type of insurance rider that when that happens you're somehow going to back them in some way. Like help us understand your solutions. [46:20] Tod Ruble: Yeah, and let's be clear. These people are borrowing to you know, for medical expenses uncovered by their health insurance to prevent an eviction or a foreclosure, kids tuition. So as real life issues that are coming up or a big. [46:34] Mark: Wouldn't that be more of a hardship versus a loan though? [46:38] Tod Ruble: Why would you want to take a hardship if it's immediate, immediately taxed and penalized when you could borrow the money, pay essentially yourself back. [46:46] Mark: Because they don't want to pay it back. They want to handle their issue and move on. [46:52] Tod Ruble: But if they borrowed from their plan, they have the liquidity. I'm not here with all because they're out of work now. [46:57] JD: I'm not backing you here Roby either. I agree with you that those are hardship things but people will take loans for those. And don't forget it wasn't too long ago where you had to exhaust your loan for things before you could take a hardship though. I know those rules have changed. [47:13] Mark: Changed. Right. [47:14] JD: But the same thing is true is that the money's been spent and tata, I get you, it was for something important that they couldn't avoid. So now to the. This is the sketchy part. How the fuck are you solving this? Because you're going to, you know, running a business. I'm not signing for it. You got to make money from it. So it is some type of insurance pay. Right play. Right. It's yeah. [47:33] Tod Ruble: We insure the entire book of loans of the 401k and they have an obligation to preserve assets as the plan sponsor and fiduciary in the event of a default. That's what they're doing. They're fulfilling their fiduciary obligation and they're preventing the loans from defaulting because people are more. Participants are more likely to roll over their entire account if it's been replenished beforehand. Somebody loses their job. We repay the loan before the default occurs and the offset occurs against the account. [48:07] JD: Okay so help, help us understand all the dynamics here. So what, what does that cost me? Let's, let's use me as an example. I'm a, let's say I'm a 40 year old participant. I've got 100k in my account and you know, and where you, you come to me through my employer, through my record keeper. And you say to me J.D. you never know what may happen. No, no. If you take a loan someday you may want to have this writer on top of it that will protect you. I don't want to start making up how it works. You tell me how it works and then what it's going to cost me and how will play out. [48:42] Tod Ruble: Yeah, we will. We'll evaluate your book of loans and for the next year we'll cover any loans that default cost somewhere between 4 to 6 basis points on your AUM a year to protect all those loans. [48:58] Justin: Interesting. [48:59] Tod Ruble: And if you think about that, it's, it's money that's half of it or thereabouts is going back into the plan. It's, it's not a fee for a service. You're buying insurance. So the insurance is going to pay benefits over a period of time and you're, you can use plan assets to pay to pay for this. You can even use. Because it's an expense of the plan because the participant doesn't own their account yet. The, the loan is an investment of the plan according to erisa. And we structure. I know we're regulatory compliant compliant because Bradford Campbell's on our advisory team and he's one of the, he's one of the attorneys of the architect along of our program along with Bob Toth, past, [49:46] JD: past guests on this show. Brad Campbell. We, we passionately, we passionately named him Scooter when he was on the show. [49:53] Tod Ruble: But yeah it's, it's pretty simple. [49:55] Mark: He's seen me at my worst. [49:57] Tod Ruble: There's blanket coverage of all the loans [49:59] Mark: in the sleep book. [50:00] Tod Ruble: It costs four costs four to six basis points. But what we can do, you're going to be able to manage and that you're automating financial wellness and then you can measure it because we'll know how many loans were defaulted. So I tried to go through an educational seminar that tells people don't borrow. You can't tell people to not to borrow during emergency. You can't. [50:23] JD: I apologize for my stupidity. But so you're going to then go to my employer and, and analyze it and then charge some basis points for this insurance on the total plan assets to, to have this in place. [50:41] Tod Ruble: Right. And anybody that. And that therefore everybody who borrow, who borrows or takes out a loan is protected with their automation. [50:50] Mark: But you also, did I read it correctly that this could be a participant expense of $2 per month for every thousand dollars they borrow? [50:58] Tod Ruble: No, I think what you're Referring to Mark is we, we can speak to it in terms of how much it would cost the. In plan assets. It's an. It's on average, like I said, four to six basis points that in dollars. [51:12] Mark: So there's no way to just charge the participant. [51:16] Tod Ruble: You can, but we're bypassing the record keepers and going straight to the plan sponsor because they have the insurable interest because they're responsible for preserving the assets in the loan. Those are plan assets. [51:26] JD: So I don't want to be the antagonist here. If, if I'm a participant in the plan that's never going to take a loan because it's just not my style. I'm responsible. I'm saving a lot. Am I paying for this feature for my fellow employees? [51:45] Tod Ruble: Well, the plan, the plan sponsors are choosing to do it with plan assets. [51:50] JD: And that's why we provide plan assets. [51:52] Tod Ruble: That's why we provide the dynamic that 40% of the people, many of them who never thought they would borrow over a five year period, that goes to 50 over seven year period. They're going to have their loans protected and they're going to automatically have them have them prevented from default. So you're improving financial wellness. [52:11] Justin: So they're prevented from default. [52:13] JD: Oh yeah. [52:13] Justin: John brought it. John asked a good question. You know, say they leave. [52:17] Tod Ruble: Yes. [52:18] Justin: Do they still pay the loan back? Do they pay you guys? [52:20] Mark: Like what happens there like a PNC [52:22] Tod Ruble: product on your house? You know, if you, if you suffered the damage, then the insurance benefits pay. Hey, pay the loan money. [52:31] Mark: So if I, so if I take a loan today for 15. [52:36] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [52:36] Mark: And then I get fired tomorrow and I have an outstanding loan balance of $15,000. I don't have to pay that back. [52:44] Tod Ruble: If you're fired for. Cause you wouldn't be. It's. It's not covered. It's dead. [52:49] Mark: My performance is terrible. So I probably would be. [52:53] Tod Ruble: But there's a, there's a waiting period on the front end. So you can't gain the system and say I'm going to leave you. Certainly not voluntari early or I'm gonna, I'm gonna do whatever I can to get laid off so that I can game the system. But keep in mind, if someone doesn't get laid off, they've then got that. The deduction coming out of their paycheck every month still for the loans. So they've got to be careful that they're not borrowing with the intent of defaulting on the loan. [53:24] Justin: Yeah, this is on that real quick. Nate asked another question too or brought up another point that I've never thought about and you guys might know the answer. Why don't we just make repayments straight in Ach. So if you leave your job, you can continue to pay that back. [53:38] JD: Well, that gets complicated. [53:40] Mark: When I honestly, when I started looking through this at first again, I, I'm honest, I didn't, I didn't know that this existed. It was all new to me. So I was doing my, my research and reading through. But I thought for some reason before I even dug into the specifics, I thought it was like if somebody defaulted on their loan, that it was almost like you were gonna take their loan and move it somewhere else and say now you can now you over time over here versus defaulting on it and having to have a big tax thing like this. So yeah, [54:15] Tod Ruble: loans aren't portable, Mark. [54:17] JD: So loans aren't. [54:18] Mark: Well, no, I get that. That's why I thought like, oh, this is something I've never heard of but now I've dug into and I get it. [54:25] JD: I just want to address. [54:26] Tod Ruble: It's a liquidity solution for loans to prevent them from defaulting. It's. That's it. You prevent. And we pay before the taxes and, and penalties are due so that you're not exacerbating the problem with, with those, with those costs associated with. [54:43] JD: So again, try to think high level because we, we get so focused on ourselves personally as participants. Think high level again and remember that this is an employer sponsored retirement plan with plan assets. And there is a reoccurring problem that happens in these defaulted loans or the. We're losing assets, they're being defaulted, they were loaned out. Right. When you get that. And Justin, this goes back to your question about the bank payments that then Moody backed you up on. When you're taking money as a loan, that's plan assets that have to go back into that plan. That's the right. So if you leave, if you leave now and I'm just gonna get your bank ACH thing to make. [55:26] Mark: What does that stand for? [55:27] Justin: Automatic. [55:28] JD: You are, you are. No, you are no longer an employee of mine. [55:34] Justin: I, I understand that side of it. [55:36] JD: Clean assets in your hands that I'm asking you to pay back. And I have no idea where you're gonna go, what your bank account's gonna. [55:44] Justin: If I default anyways, the money's not going to be in there. [55:47] JD: I'm just telling you. I don't think employees past employees trying to. [55:51] Tod Ruble: The end of the end of the next quarter after you default, the loans offset with the outstanding balance and accrued interest of the loan. This is. This will scare you. Bank of America came out in the fourth quarter 401k specialty notices and said 11% of their loans were in default at the end of the fourth quarter. That's a plan asset that needs to be protected. What do you. What would you do if your target date fund was losing 11% on an annual basis? A loan is. No. [56:21] Mark: What's the acronym for Target Day Fund? [56:25] Tod Ruble: What's the acronym? Tdf. [56:28] Mark: Thanks. [56:29] JD: No, I get it. [56:30] Mark: You gotta. [56:31] Tod Ruble: How about svf? You want to throw a Stable Value fund in there too? [56:37] JD: Shame on me. I. Part of me wants that. [56:39] Tod Ruble: No, but look, there's this $250 billion pool of debt which are employees assets that they had to borrow for an emergency is. Just because you had to borrow, you shouldn't be at risk of losing all that money that you intended to pay you back. If you just keep the employee. That was the bargain they made. Chance to say if that doesn't happen, then you're. Then I'm going to get my loans. [57:04] JD: I can sit on. I could sit on both sides of the fence on that one. But I also do get the whole point of. This is a play on. I know we're stretching a little bit, but this is a play on retirement readiness. It's a plan financial wellness. It's. It's. Hey, there's. [57:20] Tod Ruble: It's systemic guardrails. [57:21] JD: Yeah, fair enough. [57:23] Tod Ruble: That could. Okay. We've. We've been solely focused on trying to educate people not taking loans on the front end and not recognizing that they're taken for legitimate reasons. This just is a backstop that protects that from devastating their. Their future retirement outcome. Look, you know, Jack Vanderhe studied it at Ebry and called it a 2. A $2 trillion. A $2 trillion problem over a lifetime and should have loan insurance. And DC just came out and said we think from a financial wellness standpoint, that's a drink sponsor should adopt loan [57:59] JD: protection Defined contribution Investment institute or something. So drink for that. [58:06] Mark: This leads to better participant outcomes. That's what I'm hearing. [58:10] Tod Ruble: And they're automated. Participants don't have to make a choice. And it's measurable. We can. You can figure out how much was protected because you prevented X number of defaults from taking place. You can measure it. [58:25] JD: Yeah. Look, I want to move on, but let me ask you. Have you yourself presented this concept to plan sponsors or do you have minions for that? And what is their reaction to this? I mean, you feel like they get it or is it a tough. Is it a tough sell? [58:43] Tod Ruble: We. It's A good question, J.D. we originally went to the record keepers with auto enroll with an. With an opt out and had great traction with the Fortune 500 market because of the magnitude of defaults on those plans. And some of These plans have $100 million, $200 million in loans outstanding against the really large ones. But, you know, gaining, you know, some type of cooperation with the record keepers wasn't very certain back in those days. So we just iterated the program and streamlined it and sell it straight into the sponsors now. [59:17] JD: Yeah, directly plans. I think the record keepers are always difficult to partner with, no matter what the fintech or the solution is. So that's not just on you. [59:27] Tod Ruble: Well, this is just, this is just disintermediating. They don't need to be involved in the, in the, in the process. I mean, it's a plan sponsored decision. [59:36] Justin: Yeah. [59:36] JD: Okay. We'll keep our eye on it and we'll keep in touch with you on this. And I think again, that's what this show's here for is we want to be. We want. [59:45] Mark: J.D. [59:46] JD: can I finish my sentence? [59:49] Mark: No, you're. You haven't even asked the question yet. [59:52] JD: I'm not asking a question. [59:54] Mark: No. It sounds like business is going well. So how many Lambos do you own, Todd? [1:00:01] Tod Ruble: Yeah, we, we pivoted and look, it's. There's. We've signed a distributor, we've got advisors putting it in their financial wellness toolkit saying they think it's, you know, a valued. It's a liquidity solution that improves retirement outcomes. [1:00:18] Mark: But how many Lambos do you have? [1:00:21] Tod Ruble: I made a tremendous amount of money. I'll leave those. That's ridiculous. I mean, University of Texas football players. [1:00:30] JD: Whoa, take it easy on the long. [1:00:32] Tod Ruble: That's a true story, guys. That's a true story. They really are. Those kids are driving around in Lambos in Austin, Texas, God bless them. [1:00:39] Mark: So is J.D. [1:00:42] JD: all right, I know what I was saying was for us so rudely interrupted by Robe guy was that the whole point here is for us all to stay educated on this stuff and to see all these kind of moving pieces out there. And so this is a perfect type of product and solution that I want the entire chat bar to understand as well as us here is. That's not how you spell. I was trying to spell Subaru. Sorry, but keyboard. [1:01:07] Justin: Okay. [1:01:09] JD: Hey, guys, thanks for keeping me posted on the. The new chat bar Champion leaderboard. It's great. [1:01:15] Justin: I texted Mark, I said throw up the graphic. All right. I didn't want to interrupt you. [1:01:20] Mark: Hey, calm down. Oh, great. Nate Mooney. Great. Can I Hold on. Can I give. Negative. Hold on. [1:01:29] Justin: Can you get naked? No. [1:01:31] JD: All right, Knee. Can we do. Can we do a quick. Can we do a quick game? Quick game? [1:01:38] Mark: Yeah. Yeah. Game. Let's do it. [1:01:40] JD: Brandon, It's. It's totally original. [1:01:46] Mark: I think it's gonna go really well. Dude, we already did that. You weren't here for it. Get with Jesus picture. [1:02:03] JD: What is going on? All right, Todd, this is a totally original no for dope game. I made this up because I'm smart like that. And I'm going to tell you something about just, you know, general pop culture. Or it could could be 4k related. You're going to tell me whether you think it's nope or dope and then explain why. Okay, I gotta explain it first. One, Setting your alarm to wake up in the morning knowing all along you're just gonna smash that snooze button several times. Nope. Or dope. [1:02:37] Tod Ruble: I'd say dope. [1:02:38] JD: You're into that? [1:02:41] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [1:02:41] JD: How many times you smash the snooze button? [1:02:44] Tod Ruble: Just one or two. [1:02:45] Speaker E: I don't. [1:02:45] JD: Twice. That's fair. [1:02:46] Tod Ruble: I don't go deep on the reset. [1:02:48] JD: Robey, do you pop up at the time your alarm goes off? [1:02:52] Tod Ruble: No. [1:02:52] Mark: No. People who do are weird. [1:02:55] Justin: Yeah. God, you guys sleeps through anything? [1:02:57] Mark: Yeah. [1:03:00] Justin: You don't even hear it. [1:03:02] Mark: I said it so early that I snooze at least 10 times. [1:03:07] Tod Ruble: You're like, oh, it's. [1:03:08] JD: It's 2:00am oh, I've got four more hours. Great. It. [1:03:11] Mark: It feels really good to set an alarm and be like, I'm gonna get up so early. And then it's like, well, at least I tried. [1:03:18] JD: Justin, you set alarms. [1:03:22] Justin: Setting alarms are so archaic, man. I just. I prefer to play it while I wake up with the sun. And then if I'm feeling a little sleepy, just close my eyes and see what time I wake up again. [1:03:32] JD: Hey, are you listening to this? Everyone? These are. These guys lives. This is their job. Just, you know, wake up whenever. You know how paranoid I am or high, high strung I am. If I set my alarm for 5, 45, 5:30, 6, 15, whatever it is, I will naturally wake up 10, 15 minutes before my alarm goes off. Just out of pure paranoia. [1:03:54] Justin: I sleep like the night I have to wake up. Someone asked about a flight. Yeah, you just missed the flight at that point. But yeah, the nights before flights where I don't set Alarms. I just. Yeah, I'm waking up 10 times throughout the evening. [1:04:05] Mark: There's always 15 minutes news. [1:04:07] JD: By the way, what a genius thing to name it. The snooze button. That guy was a marketing. [1:04:14] Justin: Really was. [1:04:14] JD: Todd. Fancy bartenders, I believe they're called, like, mixologists. And not just them as humans, their creations. This is not just a vodka soda. You're gonna get an experience of all kinds of things and flowers and umbrellas. Are you. Nope. Or dope on mixologists and their craft. [1:04:43] Tod Ruble: I think it's dope. I think it's kind of cool that they've got all those different herbs and everything else that they use to. To. They're. Look, they're artisans. [1:04:52] JD: They are artisans in a. [1:04:54] Tod Ruble: In a certain space. So it's different than somebody being a great chef. They're just. [1:05:01] JD: I'm changing my. Yeah, I'm with you. I'm starting to change my mind on this. [1:05:04] Justin: Justin 401k artisan. [1:05:06] JD: Do you go and do you buy a bougie drink out at a fancy. [1:05:09] Justin: If I'm on vacation, absolutely, man. Just give them. Give them all to me. [1:05:13] JD: But you know what I'm talking about, like, oh, it's got smoke in it. And who knows? [1:05:17] Justin: Yeah. On vacation, I'll do that all the time around. [1:05:19] Tod Ruble: Ice is from an Atlanta. From an Atlantic. [1:05:22] Justin: Ice being interrupted. [1:05:23] JD: There you go. [1:05:23] Mark: There you go. [1:05:24] JD: That's a good interruption. [1:05:25] Tod Ruble: And they chip off a square. A square. [1:05:27] Speaker E: Yeah, you're right. [1:05:28] JD: Hey, Todd, I was about to tell you. It's not your turn, but that was a good. [1:05:32] Justin: That was a good. It really was. [1:05:35] Tod Ruble: But you're not. You're not exposed for failing to preserve that asset. So you're going to be. [1:05:40] JD: Oh, let's not start making analogies to loan defaults. I. I have always just been a. Just give me Grey Goose soda, a little bit of oj. Like, I just want my standard drink. Right. But recently there's been this cool little bar I've been going to close to my place. And the guys that are fancy, they got kind of the mustaches and wear their hipster clothes and these guys know. [1:06:08] Justin: Does that like the swinging doors where you walk through like a snow? [1:06:10] JD: Pretty much, yeah. And. And they know, like, how many ounces they're putting in and this and that. And this is from France or England. And they only use this bourbon for this. And I'm starting to become a fan. Like, some of the shit's pretty good. I'm a big fan now of a. A Mezcal Old Fashioned. This guy's making me, dude. [1:06:33] Justin: I've had one of those before. It's pretty good. [1:06:35] JD: I'm like, holy. So anyways, that's where I sit on it. Road guy. Nobody cares what you think. Okay, Todd, in the same vein, Michelin starred restaurants. Nope. Or dope. [1:06:55] Tod Ruble: That's tough because my daughter wants to go to CIA, so. Institute of America. It's dope. [1:07:04] JD: So yeah, you'd be dope on that. That'd be her dream. That's her goal is not a regular diet. [1:07:08] Tod Ruble: But it's dope. [1:07:10] JD: Roby, have you ever been or. [1:07:14] Mark: No. [1:07:15] JD: Just. [1:07:16] Speaker E: Just. [1:07:16] Mark: No. Come on. I don't want to eat somewhere for a thousand dollars and then have to go to Taco Bell afterwards. O [1:07:24] JD: so just so happens. True story. I was at one last night. Which prompted this. This. Nope. And Mark's right. Fifteen courses of tiny little little things with explosions. But much like the mixologist, I would say Michelin is pretty dope. Okay, last. [1:07:45] Mark: You know what Michelin? [1:07:47] Tod Ruble: The. [1:07:47] Mark: The star. [1:07:48] Tod Ruble: That. [1:07:48] Mark: It's the tire company. Dude, why are we making a big deal out of this, man? It's like, cool. You know why you judge restaurants? What? The. [1:07:59] JD: You know why The. The tire company used to give you maps around the world and they would. It slowly evolved into, hey, when you're in this town on our tires, you should stop at this restaurant and. [1:08:14] Mark: And then just. Just totally default on all your loans because you're not going to be able to pay for your dinner. Yeah. [1:08:20] Tod Ruble: Yeah. [1:08:20] JD: Well. Hey, Todd, do you know what percentage of participants that default on their loan go to Michelin restaurants? Okay, last one, Todd. Last one. And this is. Yeah, this one came to me. [1:08:34] Tod Ruble: You're saying insure. Ensuring the loan that they take out to go to the Michelin star restaurant. [1:08:40] Mark: Either one. [1:08:40] Justin: I don't know. [1:08:41] Mark: It doesn't matter. [1:08:42] JD: Yeah, that'd be a great use case [1:08:44] Tod Ruble: you can get by. Why they use the money. They still should insure it because if they lose their job, they had a good meal and they're [1:08:52] Mark: probably not a good meal. [1:08:53] JD: You just inspired me to. To reach out to the American Retirement Association. We need to lobby for adding Michelin star dine outs to the hardship list. Wow. Okay, here's the last one. And I don't know, maybe you guys can tell me what this is called, but I'm going to call it a failed sneeze. Nope. Or dope. I'm gonna sneeze. I'm gonna sneeze. [1:09:20] Justin: And then it better be dope across the board. [1:09:22] Speaker E: Or. [1:09:23] Justin: No, I meant nope. I Meant. [1:09:24] Mark: Nope, it's worst. [1:09:28] Tod Ruble: Nope. I hate the feeling. I don't know how many people have to look at the sun like a lot of other people do. It helps you sneeze. The feeling of every. Everything accumulating there and then you're just stuck with a stopped up nose because you couldn't sneeze. [1:09:44] JD: J, man, that's a horrible feeling, is it not? [1:09:47] Mark: Yeah, [1:09:51] Justin: it's almost as bad as blue balls, man. [1:09:55] JD: I mean if, yeah there was, if there was a novel Sunko there. But yeah, I just have to say like in life, Roby, because that sneeze, you could describe it better than me. Like you're kind of excited about the release of this. Yeah, it's something that needs to happen and then all of a sudden it doesn't need to happen anymore. But, but no, you still need, it [1:10:16] Mark: still needs to happen just for the same [1:10:20] JD: blue nose. [1:10:21] Justin: I like that, Brandon. [1:10:22] Mark: That's pretty good. That's just the worst feeling ever. [1:10:27] JD: Yeah, okay, I had one more thing, but I'll just, you know. Fucking Human Interest unveils new artificial intelligence tool for 4.1K compliance monitoring it looks [1:10:39] Mark: they've been, have they been looking over your shoulder? J.D. no. [1:10:43] JD: By the way, when I see these, I do initially worry and I go, oh, is someone coming out with something as cool as the I'm coming out with? And then usually I go in almost 100 of the time I go and read, I'm like, oh no, they're just doing something cheesy. This to me looks more like a predictive actual deferral percentage test monitor type of thing, which is really cool. [1:11:03] Mark: But I think as, as nerds we can all pick. Poke holes in that because it's not going to be perfect. [1:11:08] JD: Yeah, no, we can maybe save that for a later show. But thank you for saying that, Roby. Predicting a failed or a past ADP test is usually not worth the energy that goes into it. [1:11:21] Mark: Yeah, I will say as, as, again, as a, as a nerdy person, I do think it's pretty cool. I will say, but it's got to be done correctly or else you're just giving people false information. [1:11:34] Justin: They have the data, it's good. But the area that I do actually I'm a big fan of it for is top heavy. Like if you know going into the year beforehand, you know you're not going to be heavy. [1:11:45] JD: That's going to be phenomenal. That could save you a big, big headache to me if you're, if you tell me in July that I'm Potentially going to fail my actual deferral percentage test. What am I going to do? Restrain my highly competent. [1:12:03] Justin: You don't want to do that anyways. [1:12:04] JD: You think I'm going to run out there and do an. [1:12:06] Mark: Can it do a what? Can I do a predictive top paid group election? Can we. Can we get really into that and do things like that? [1:12:13] JD: If top paid group works, I'm all probably. [1:12:15] Justin: But I. I read this article thinking like the concept is cool. I do like to talk the top heavy part. But from the test, the deferral test, it's like you want your people to be ma. Be able to max out. You don't want to limit them. And two, it's going to create more work on the back end for you having to inform all your highly comp saying, hey, stop saving, stop saving, stop saving. Just let it happen. [1:12:38] JD: And by the way, who do you tell to stop saving? What if you have. [1:12:42] Justin: Yeah, that's a good point. [1:12:43] JD: Highly comped. Secondly, and I know the expert people out there know this, like if you're a smaller firm, what if, you know, what if it's one guy getting. You know, two guys can get a bonus at the end of the year. Yeah, that would completely change the numbers. Someone a non highly comped could backload towards the end of the year and put a bunch of money in. I mean as soon as that census starts to shrink to 10 people, 12 people, 6 people. That needle moves quickly when things like that happen. [1:13:13] Justin: So you're having the monthly update does help predict that a little bit more cleanly. And then just doing a mid year test at some point though. [1:13:18] JD: Yeah. So I don't know. I like to see people using artificial intelligence and pushing the norm. So I should say kudos. God bless that. [1:13:26] Tod Ruble: But. [1:13:27] JD: All right, that's it, everyone. The your chapter champion tonight is the guy with the hottest sister on the planet. Unless things have changed since I last saw the leaderboard, I'm sure they haven't. Oh, oh, oh, wait. I think there's a foul play going on. [1:13:46] Mark: Oh, I did Moody. It went through the negative. Did it really? Oh, that's so good. You. [1:13:54] JD: Oh my God. Okay, everyone, this is a day to remember and retire hawks history. For 10 plus years we have transparent. We have been honest. We have been like, you know, full of integrity. [1:14:11] Justin: No more. [1:14:12] JD: No more. [1:14:14] Mark: I love it. [1:14:15] JD: And Nate, I'm not gonna stand by and watch this. I'm not gonna say I watch this. Nate Mooney is the chat bar champion tonight, people. Not Greg Greenfield. You didn't Earn it. [1:14:24] Mark: Hey, Greg. You're my champion. Greg, you are my champion. [1:14:28] JD: Congratulations, Nate. Congratulations, Nate. What you have won is an all expense paid trip for your sister to San Diego, California. Let her know. Room, board, everything. Todd, thank you so much for joining us on this crazy show. I know it has lowered your impression of the retirement plan industry in its current state. That's what we do. We drag it down. Sorry about that. I know it used to be professional and cool, but no more. We it all up. But we appreciate you for coming here and we wish you the best of luck with the company. To all you out there listening in, we love you. Good to see you again. We'll see you next time. By the way, I've got guests booked through November, December and we've got some bangers coming. So tune in next time. Should be a fun one actually. Next show's guest is in the chat bar tonight. Or he was. He might be gone now. [1:15:30] Justin: Is it Todd with two Ds? [1:15:31] JD: No, he's still there. But I'll let you guess because it's someone who's never been on this show before. Stay tuned to my social media. You'll see. And it's very different from what we've had on the show before. This is not a financial advisor. This is not a record keeper. This is none of those. This is not an ERISA attorney. I'll drink. This is someone else. And they're in the chat bar right now with that. Yeah, it. We'll see you next time. We already try to retire holics. That's. And we are changing the retirement plan industry. One very large bottle of kettle one at a time. We'll see you next time. Brandon, play the music. Todd, thank you so much. See you later. [1:16:16] Mark: Thank you, Todd. Yep. [1:16:17] Tod Ruble: Thank you guys. [1:16:18] Justin: Thanks, Todd. See you guys. [1:16:19] Tod Ruble: Take care. [1:16:20] Justin: You too.